III. 1700. The 18th, After Debate concerning the Treaty of Parti- Anno 12 Will. tion, it was propofed, that it appears, that the French King's Acceptance of the Will of the King of Spain is a manifest Violation of the Treaty, and humbly to advise the King, that, in all future Treâties with the French King, his Majefty do proceed with fuch Caution as may carry along with it a real Security. After Debate thereupon, the Question was put, Whether Queftion relathe faid Propofal fhall go to the Committee to be one of the ting to the Heads for the Addrefs? It was refolved in the Affirmative. Diffentient' French King's ift, Because it must be conftrued to be an Approbation of Proteft thereon the Treaty, which (as we conceive) was not intended by the House. 2dly, Becouse it is impoffible to know the full Meaning and Extent of real Security. Nottingham, Granville, Normanby, Rochefter, Weymouth, The 20th, An Addrefs to his Majefty touching the Treaty of Partition was reported and agreed to. And the Question being put, Whether this Address shall be communicated to the House of Commons for their Concurrence? Addrefs touch ing the Treaty of Partition It was refolved in the Negative. Contents 27; Not con- Not to be com tents 45. Diffentient' municated to the Commons. ift, Because, we conceive that the laft Claufe in the Ad- Proteft thereon, dreis does neceffarily imply a War, and that a very long one, by reason of the Extent, unintelligible at leaft to us, of a real Security, and the greateft Improbability of obtaining any Terms of that kind; and fince this neceffarily implies great Supplies, which cannot be granted without the House of Commons, we think their Concurrence, in this Advice, abfolutely neceffary, and that it is very improper for us to defire that of the King, which, for want of fuch Concurrence of the Commons, we conceive, his Majefty will not think fit or prudent to grant. 2dly, We conceive all the other Parts of the Address very fit to be communicated to the Houfe of Commons, for upon the Succefs of it depends the future Happiness of this Nation; and as we cannot doubt of the Readiness of the Commons to join in any proper Measures towards it, fo we think their Concurrence in it would highly contribute towards the obtaining a gracious Anfwer from his Majefty; and we cannot but think it reasonable that the Advice of the whole Nation, 1700. E Anno 12 Will. tion, affembled in Parliament, fhould be made known to his III. 1700. Majefty upon this Occafion. A Counter-Ad dress to one of the Com 3dly, Having defired the Houfe of Commons to permit Mr. Secretary Vernon, a Member of their House, to come to a Committee of Lords to inform them of fome Matters relating to this Treaty; we apprehend, that the Houfe of Commons may think it extraordinary, and not fuitable to the good Correfpondence which is highly neceffary between the two Houses, not to acquaint them with the things which have come to our Knowledge, partly by the Information of their own Member. 4thly, And having been otherwife informed of fome Tranfactions relating to this Treaty between the Earl of Portland and Mr. Secretary Vernon, by Letters, of which we have not had a full Account, we think it may be very ufeful to the Public to communicate this Addrefs to the Commons, who have better Opportunity than we have had of enquiring into this Matter, which feems to be yet in the dark, and which their own Member may help to explain to them. Leeds, De Longueville, Weymouth, Jeffreys, Guilford, Tho. On Occafion of this Treaty the Commons impeached the Earl of Portland, the Earl of Oxford, Lord Somers, and Lord Hallifax; and addreffing his Majefty to remove them from his Prefence and Council's, it drew from the Peers a CounterAddrefs, which, being carried by a Majority of twenty, ocfrom the King's cafioned the following Proteft : mons, relating to the Removal of certain Lords Prefence. Proteft thereon: Laft Protefta tion to be expunged. Diffentient' ift, Because, we conceive, it is contrary to the Method of Proceeding in Parliament, to take notice in this House of what is represented only, by fome Lords, to have paffed in the other. zdly, And it is not proper to addrefs the King on a Subject that is not before this Houfe to judge of, which may engage this Houfe in what is indecent towards his Majefty, and may be of ill Confequence between the two Houfes. Scarfdale, Normanby, Carnarvon, Thanet, Ormond, Kent, But Exception being taken to the beforementioned Proteftation, the Proteftation was read; And after Debate, the Queflion was put, Whether the first Reafon in the Proteftation fhall stand? It was refolved in the Negative. Contents 22; Not con- Anno 13 Will. tents 28. Then the fecond Reafon in the Proteftation was read. After Debate, the Question was put, Whether the fecond Reason in the Proteftation fhall stand? It was refolved in the Negative. The foregoing Reasons were order'd to be expunged, but the above may be depended upon as a genuine Copy. Diffentient III. 1701. Because it is the Privilege of the Peers to enter their Dif- Proteft thereon. fent, and it has been the ancient Practice to enter also their Reasons of fuch Diffent, of which the Lords that so protest are the most proper Judges, as well knowing what Arguments perfuaded them to be of that Opinion; and no Reasons can be more proper than fuch as they conceive are founded upon Matter of Fact. Sandwich, Carnarvon, Feversham, Rochester, Weymouth, Howard, Granville, Poulet, Lexington, H. London, Jonat. Exon', Willoughby, Ormond, Normanby, Thanet, Scarfdale, Townshend, Abingdon, Dartmouth, Wefton, Guilford, Jeffreys. The Addrefs itself was to the following Purpofe; That The faid Ad'the Commons having feverally impeached, at the Bar of dress. 'their House, the Earls of Portland and Orford, and the 'Lords Somers and Hallifax, of High Crimes and Mifde'meanors, and having acquainted their Lordships that they 'would, in due time, exhibit particular Articles against 'thefe impeach'd Lords, and make the fame good; they ' most humbly befought his Majesty, that he would be pleaf. 'ed to país no Cenfure upon them, till they were tried upon 'the faid Impeachment, and Judgment were given, accord'ing to the Ufage of Parliament and the Laws of the Land.' To this Addrefs, tho' prefented by the Duke of Devonshire, The King re and the Earl of Romney, two Perfons 'greatly in the King's turns no AnIntereft, his Majesty gave no manner of Answer; at which fwer. the House of Lords were fomewhat piqued, and thereupon appointed a Committee to enquire, if there was any Prece dent of the King's Silence upon the like Occafions. This drew on a long and vehement Controverfy between the two House (to be found in CHANDLER's Hift. as likewise the Articles against the four Lords, and the Replies, Anno 13 Will. III. 1701, from page 147 to 182,) in the Courfe of which occur'd the following Particulars, being all that are neceffary to render the Hiftory of that remarkable Affair complete. July the 3d, Report was made of an Aniwer, drawn by Anfwer to the a Committee, to be fent to the House of Commons, to their Commons reMollage ported. E 2 Anno 13 Will. Meffage received the 31st of May laft, relating to the Impeachments now depending against the four Lords. And the first Paragraph being read, was agreed to. III. 1701. First and fecond Amendment propos'd, And agreed to. Proteft thereon. Laft Paragraph. Agreed to. Proteft thereon. Then the second Paragraph was read as follows, viz. (And as the Lords do not controvert what Right the Commons may have of impeaching in general Terms, if they please, fo the Lords, in whom the Judicature does entirely refide, think themselves obliged to affert, that the Right of determining what is a due Time, in which the particular Articles of Impeachment ought to be exhibited, is lodged in them only.) It being propofed that an Amendment be made in this Paragraph, that inftead of the Words, viz (Determining what is a due Time in which the particular Articles of Impeachment ought to be exhibited, is lodged in them only) thefe Words may be inferted, viz. (Limiting a convenient Time for bringing the particular Charge before them for the avoiding Delay in Juftice, is lodged in them.) After Debate, the Queftion was put, Whether the second Paragraph, fo amended, shall ftand? It was refolved in the Affirmative. Contents 43; Not contents 27. Diffentient Because, we conceive, this Affertion is new. Normanby, Oxford, Jonat. Exon', Weymouth, Jeffreys, Then the laft Paragraph was read, as follows, viz. (The Lords hope the Commons, on their Part, will be as careful not to do any thing that may tend to the Interruption of the good Correfpondence between the Houses, as the Lords fhall ever be on their Part; and the best Way to preserve that, is for neither of the two Houfes to exceed thofe Limits which the Law and Custom of Parliaments have already established.) And, after Debate, the Queftion was put, Whether the laft Paragraph fhall stand? It was refolved in the Affirmative. Diffentient' Because we know not that the Law and Cuftom of Parliaments have established any certain Limits. Normanby, H. London, Rochester, Oxford, Guilford, Howard, Dartmouth, Cholmondeley, Nottingham, Tho. Roffen', Abingdon, Granville, Lexington, Plymouth, Hunfdon, Marl. borough, borough, fonat. Exon', Weymouth, Jeffreys, Lindley, La- Anno 13 Will. warr, Godolphin. III. 1701. The 9th, It being moved to have a Conference with the Refolution not Commons, to let them know, that the Lords do not agree to have a Com to a Committee of both Houses in relation to the Trials of mittee of both Houses in relathe impeached Lords; after Debate thereupon, tion to the This Question was put, Whether a Committee of this Trials of the House fhall be appointed to meet with a Committee of the impeached House of Commons, in relation to the Proceedings upon Lords. the Impeachments? It was refolved in the Negative, Diffentient Because the Lords, in the Year One thousand fix hundred Proteft thereon. feventy-nine, confented to a Committee of Lords and Commons, for regulating the Trials of the Popish Lords; and therefore the refufing to comply with the Commons in the fame Requeft, at this Time, will be (in our Opinion) a great Obftacle to the Trials of the impeached Lords. Somerfet, Denbigh, Lawarr, Jonat. Exon', Oxford, Peter borough, Dartmouth, Derby, Rochefter, Guilford, Carnar. von, Lexington, Nottingham, Howard, Normanby, Weymouth, Torrington, Marlborough, Abingdon, H. London, Godolphin, No Lord, upon The 11th, The Meffage received Yefterday from the House of Commons was read; and after Debate of the feveral Par- his Trial to be ticulars contained in it, without the This Queftion was propofed, That no Lord of Parlia. Bar. ment, impeached of high Crimes and Misdemeanors, and coming to his Trial, fhall, upon his Trial, be without the Bar. Then the previous Queftion was put, Whether this Quef. tion fhall be now put? It was refolved in the Affirmative. Diffentient Because, however reasonable this Propofition may appear Proteft thereon. to us, yet we conceive it very improper to determine it, be fore we have heard what the Commons can fay upon it. Nottingham, Jonat. Exon, Abingdon, Weymouth, Tho. Roffen, Guilford, H. London, Rochester, Torrington. The 11th, A Meffage was fent to the Houfe of Commons Meffage to the by Sir John Hofkins and Dr. Newton, to acquaint them, that Commons for upon the Occafion of their last Meffage Yesterday, in order a free Confeto continue a good Correfpondence between the two Houses, their Lordships did immediately appoint a Committee to ftate rence. |