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Do you think you would probably have heard of it if the fact had been so ?-I think
James Samson cross-examined by Mr. Jeffrey so.
for Thomas Baird. Have you ever heard him talk of the measures Look at what is written before the beginning of government ?-Yes.
of that speech, where it is stated, that a Mr. What way did he express himself?--He used Burt and a Mr. White could not attend, but to approve of the measures of government. had transmitted addresses to be read to the
Did you ever hear any arguments between meeting. Yours was given in the name of him and others on politics ?-Yes, he took the Mr. Burt, and you understood it was Mr. government side.
Burt's speech you read?-Mr. Baird said Mr. Do you know of his having been a member Burt had sent it to him. of any military body?-I believe he served in
It was not Mr. Baird's writing, but Mr. the Local Militia, in the Rifle corps.
Burt's!Yes. Did you look' on him as a man of a seditious turn of mind, or as a friend to the go- The following Declarations of the Panels vernment ?--As a friend to the government.
were then read. Did you ever hear any imputation to the contrary cast on him ?-İ do not remember
Declaration of Alexander M‘Laren. ever hearing any.
At Kilmarnock, the 26th day of February Do you know any thing about his objecting in the year 1817, in presence of William to his speech being printed ?-No.
Eaton, Esq. Sheriff-substitute of Ayrshire, Lord Advocale. -Do you know who drew appeared Alexander M'Laren, weaver in the petition ?-No.
Kilmarnock; who being examined, deDid you ever read it ?—Yes.
clares, That he is a native of Perthshire,
and in April next he has been eight years David Bow sworn.-Examined by
in Kilinarnock. Declares, That there was Mr. Drummond,
a public meeting held at the Dean Park, What is Mr. Baird ?-He has a grocer's
near Kilmarnock, on the 7th of Decemshop.
ber last : That that meeting was for the Were the pamphlets sold at Mr. Baird's
purpose of petitioning Parliament for a
reform of grievances. Declares, That preshop?-Yes.
vious to that meeting there was a comMany of them ?—Many. I could not say
mittee of certain individuals in Kilmaras to the number. Some dozens?-Yes; some dozens.
nock, for the purpose of bringing about
the said meeting : That the c'eclarant atFifty copies?-I believe there might. What were they sold for?-Fourpence each.
tended that committee, and David Ramsay Andrews, writer in Kilmarnock, Tho
mas Baird and Andrew Finnie, merchants David Bow cross-examined by Mr. Jeffrey
there, also attended that meeting, and the for Thomas Baird.
declarant has reason to suppose they were Do you know if they were sold any where
members of ii as well as himself. Deelse? Yes.
clares, That the declarant first appeared Lord Advocate.—Where?—Different persons
on the hustings and opened the mee'ing; of the committee got them.
and being shewn an “Account of the Mention who got them?-Mr. Finnie, Mr.
Proceedings of the Public Meeting of the Johnstone.
Burgesses and Inhabitants of the town of How do you know that?-Because I saw Kilmarnock," and wherein is engrossed, them given away. They were given to be sold on part of the fifth page, sixth, and part by Mr. Baird.
of the seventh page, what the declarant Besides those given to the members of the said at opening the above meeting. Decommittee, several dozens were sold in your
clares, That the declarant has perused shop ?-Yes.
said speech, and it is near what the de
clarani said on the above occasion, except James Samson, sworn, - Examined by
what is said about the middle of the sea Mr. Drummond.
venth page about allegiance, which the
declarant thinks he did not deliver in the [The pamphlet was handed to the witness.]
words as expressed in the publication. Have you seen this pamphlet?-Yes.
Declares, That on the morning of the Have you seen in it the statement of a above meeting, the declarant put into wrispeech said to have been made by you?--Yes. ting what he
must say at the opening of Have you read it? Is it a fair account of the meeting: That he afterwards gave his what you said ?-It is near about it.
part of the manuscript to those who were Did you compose the speech yourself ?- appointed by the committee to superinNo.
tend the printing of the proceedings, that Where did you get it?-From Mr. Baird.
the same might be published along with Before the meeting?-Yes.
the rest. Declares, That James JohnDid you speak or read it ?- I read it.
stone, muslin agent in the Waterside of
Kilmarnock, was called to the chair, and from a memorandum book. . And being on that occasion he made a speech, which shown a manuscript consisting of ninewas much approved of by those present. teen pages, declares, That he is pretty Declares, That the resolutions, as engross- certain that it is the same that he read ed in said publication, are the same that to the meeting, and which the declarant were read at the public meeting, and the
some days afterwards in Walter manuscript was read to the committee, Andrew's office, and which is doqueted previous to the meeting, by Thomas and signed as relative hereto. Declares, Baird, merchant in Kilmarnock, one of That the proceedings were ordered to be the members. Declares, That Hugh Craw- printed, and the declarant was appointed ford, printer in Kilmarnock, was employed by the committee, along with several to print the proceedings of the meeting, others, to superintend the printing : That which were afterwards sold at fourpence the declarant assisted in correcting the a-piece, to enable the committee to de- grammatical errors in the Manuscript, fray the expenses. Declares, That the de- along with the said Walter Andrew, and clarant attended a meeting of the commit- the declarant assisted a little at the printtee, when those who spoke gave in their ing-office in correcting the proof copy. manuscripts for printing, and the decla- And being shown a half-sheet of paper, rant thinks the foresaid Thomas Baird was titled on the back “ No. 5. Mr. Burt's present: That a committee was appointed letter," declares, That said words are of to superintend the printing, and the said the declarant's hand-writing, and the said Thomas Baird and Andrew Finnie were half-sheet of paper was given in by the of that committee. And being shewn declarant to the printer, along with the the printed report before mentioned, de- rest of the manuscripts; and said halfclares, That he heard none of the authors sheet of paper is doqueted and signed by find fault with any thing that is therein the declarant and sheriff-substitute as contained ; and the said publication is relative hereto. Declares, That the prodoqueted and signed by the declarant and ceedings of said meeting were printed Sheriff as relative hereto. Declares, by Hugh Crawford, and a great number That the words on the sixth page, “The of copies were sent to the declarant's fact is, we are ruled by men only solici- shop, and he retailed them at fourpence tous for their own aggrandizement, and a-piece; and being shown a copy of they care no farther for the great body of the publication, declares, That it is a the people than they are subservient to copy of the proceedings which were pubtheir accursed purposes,” were in the ma- lished and circulated as above, and is nuscript wrote by the declarant, but were doqueted and signed as relative hereto; not repeated by him at the public meeting all which he declares to be true. In wit. when on the hustings as above. And the ness whereof, &c. &c. foregoing declaration being distinctly read over, he declares that it contains the
EVIDENCE IN EXCULPATION. truth. In witness, &c. &c.
James Samson sworn.-Examined by Declaration of Thomas Baird.
Mr. Grant. A Kilmarnock, the 26th day of February You remember a public meeting at Kilmarin the year 1817, in presence of William nock last December. Was it for the purpose Eaton, Esq. Sheriff-substitute of Ayrshire, of petitioning parliament? or what was the appeared Thomas Baird, merchant in object ?—To petition parliament. Kilmarnock; who being examined, de- Were you a member of any committee reclares, That there was a meeting of several garding that meeting ?-Yes. persons in the town of Kilmarnock in the
Are you well acquainted with the objects of month of November last, for the purpose those who were concerned in that meeting ?of taking into consideration whether or not I know as to any meetings I was at of the there should be a general meeting for the committee, what I heard there. purpose of petitioning the Prince Regent What was its object then ?-Entirely to peand both Houses of Parliament for a re- tition parliament. form : That the declarant was preses of the Do you know who were proposed to open first meeting only: That there were several the business of the meeting by a speech? after meetings, some of which the declarant Different persons. attended, and the 7th of December last Do you remember any of their names ?-I was fixed for a general meeting at the could not say I entirely recollect, except bim Dean Park: That the declarant attended that did it; but I know that others were prothat meeting, and Alexander M‘Laren, posed. weaver in Kilmarnock, mounted the At what time was it proposed that Mr. hustings, and opened the meeting with a M‘Laren should open the meeting ?-About a speech : That James Johnstone, muslin week before the meeting took place. agent in Kilmarnock, was called to the Did he accept readily the office of opening chair, and read a speech to the meeting the meeting ?--He did not.
Did he object to doing it?-Yes.
take? Did he oppose those that were on the Did he suggest any one else to do it?- Opposition side 3-Yes. Yes.
Was he a man given to riotous proceedings, Whom?---Mr. Blackwood.
or was he industrious at his business, and quiet Did he suggest any other person ?-He was in his conduct ?-He was industrious at his for imposing it on me.
business, and quiet in his conduct. Did you consent to do it?-No.
Was he ever connected with any society, What was the last time he urged you? except this committee ?-No, never. About an hour before the meeting took Is he a sober man, or is he given to company place.
and liquor?-Not that I know of; he is a sober Did he state he was prepared or unprepared ?-I did not know that he had anything Were you present at the committee when prepared; but he said he was not a fit hand there was a talk of printing the proceedings ? for it.
Yes. It was on your refusal that he undertook the Did you see, or hear read before the comoffice himself ?-Yes.
mittee, a manuscript purporting to be a speech What was the object of the petition? What of Mr. M‘Laren-It was not at that comwas it about ?- To obtain a reform in parlia- mittee I think; it was at a previous one. ment.
There was a subsequent committee !-Yes. Was there any conversation as to what was And you heard read over what purported to be done in case the petitions were not as- to be a speech of Mr. M‘Laren ?-Yes. sented to ?-Yes. What was to be done ?–To petition again.
[The pamphlet was handed to the witness.] Did you hear Mr. MʻLaren make his Did you ever read this publication ?-Yes. speech ?-I was present and heard some of it, Do you récollect a passage in the printed but I did not hear it distinctly.
speech about allegiance ?-I could not say; I From what cause ?-One reason was, that I think so. was behind him, and the wind carried the Look at these words. Do you remember sound of his voice to the other side ; and as I hearing the manuscript read? and do you knew I had to read a speech myself, 'I was a recollect in it the words at the end about little agitated.
allegiance, and so on, which are now in that From the general import of the speech, did printed paper ?-I could not say they were you gather its purpose was, to excite riot and there. disturbance, or to induce people to come for- Can you say they were not there ?- They ward to sign this petition ?--The latter. were not there, I think, when he delivered the
Do you know that petitions were proposed ? paper. -Not then. The resolutions were read and Say what was not there ?- I think the two approved of, and the petitions were to be ac- or three last lines were not in the manuscript: cording to the spirit of these resolutions. “Yes, my fellow countrymen, in such a case,
Whát steps were taken for preparing the to — with our allegiance.” petitions ?-I could not say positively about Do you recollect the appearance of the that.
manuscript ?-I think it was folded in a nar. Did you sign any petitions ?—Yes.
row strip like a sheet folded over again. How many?-- Three, I think.
It had been folded, I think, before it was To whom were they addressed ?—To the written on. Prince Regent, the House of Lords, and the Was the paper folded thus ?--A sheet of House of Commons.
foolscap paper shown to the witness folded in Do you know whether they were forwarded ? octavo.}-Yes, it was folded in that manner. -I believe they were.
Was it written bookwise ?-Yes, I think . Were you ever molested in consequence of so. having signed any of these petitions !-No. I do not ask you who did what I am going
Did you ever hear of any one being mo- to mention, but did any body at that commitTested !-No.
tee, not Mr. M'Laren, make any pencil markHave you known Mr. M'Laren a long time? ing on that paper ?--Yes, I think they did. It --A considerable tiine.
was not Mr. M‘Laren. In your opinion what was his character as to
now what these marks were ?-I quietness of demeanor and loyalty?-He was did not see the marks. regarded as one of the loyalest men where he Did you hear any person read the alteration lived previous to this charge of sedition. made by the marks?-Yes.
Have you ever conversed with him on poli- Was this correction immediately read ?-tical questions ?--Sometimes about the doors ; | Yes. and I have heard him dispute with others, and Did the person who read that correction read support the side of administration.
it as a correction he had made with these pencil How long ago is it since you heard him ex- marks?-I think he did. press his opinion on such subjects? --More than What was the purport of that correction? a year sjnice.
It is now at the end of this printed speech. In disputing with others what side did he You signed the petition to the House of
Commons : should you know the purport of it, may state the import of them in the address to if you saw it? I think I should.
the jury; but they cannot be put in here in Look at that? (page 82, of the printed votes evidence. of the House of Commons. ]-I cannot collect every word or sentence. I think that
Lord Advocate.-If any statement had been
made to me of a wish that the trial should is the petition. I see sentences that were
have been delayed, I would have willingly there,
conceded the delay. You recollect the words where you see a X ? I could not say positively.
Mr. Grunt.—The thing was not thought of Do you recollect any of them ?-One part sufficient importance, and the mistake did not about " indemnity for the past” in the sentence appear till last night. -[The passage which Mr. Grant read was
Mr. Clerk.--Your lordships have heard some pointed out to the witness.]
evidence which shows that the meeting was Do you remember that passage ?–I cannot for the purpose of petitioning the Regent and remember it.
the two Houses of Parliament. And you have James Samson cross-examined by the heard that a petition was forwarded to the Lord Advocate.
House of Commons; and reference has been Who were present when these pencil marks made to a paper, which we state to be a copy of
the printed votes of that house. We wish were made on the manuscript speech?-I for
to produce evidence of this, and of some others
of the same description, for the purpose of I suppose so. Who more?--John Ken
showing what sort of language is permitted to nedy. That is two. Any more ?-Archibald Craig. it is for our plea to show you what language it
that llouse. I need not state how necessary That is three. Who else was there? I do
is lawful to use in such cases. not recollect any.
In preparing Do you say there were no more present ?- such language must of course also be permit
the petitions, and in debates on the subject, There were others.
ted. We can have the productions proved by Let us hear the names of some more of them?
Lord Adrocate.--I think it competent to obWas it by any of those you have named ject to these productions, and to the evidence that the pencil marking was made - Yes. proposed to be brought as to the accuracy of Which of them ?-Mr. Baird.
them. You have the book lying before you, tell us
Mr. Clerk. – Do you admit them ? what was altered? — The latter clauses or clause.
Lord Advocate.— I have not read them, and Was any thing put in or left out ?-It was I know nothing of them. put in the manuscript by Mr. Baird.
Lord Justice Clerk.-The lord advocate only Did he give his reason for putting it in ?-- admits that it is the practice to print votes of Yes; because the manuscript delivered was
the House, and that these offered in evidence not complete according to the way in which have the appearance of being copies. It is the speech was spoken, and therefore Mr.Baird
not usual to call on counsel to be evidence in
the trial. As an agent for the prisoners could Did Mr. M‘Laren make any objections to
not be admitted as evidence, I think it would this alteration ?-I did not hear.
be better to call on some other person than Mr. Grant.-We would have brought seve- Mr. Grant. I observe a noble lord present ral witnesses in addition to those for the whose testimony might be given. crown, to testify as to the character of the prisoner MʻLaren ; and it is my duty to inform
Lord Gillies.--Mr. Grant can be examined
as a haver. you of a mistake by which we have been deprived of this opportunity. The letters of Lord Advocate.-I go so far as to say that exculpation, with instructions to cite witnesses I have no reason to doubt the genuineness of to prove the good character of the prisoner the copies. M'Laren, were, by a mistake of the proprietors of the coach at Kilmarnock, forwarded to a
Mr. Clerk.-I conceive you have been in person of the same name as that on the address the use to receive papers from agents, and to
An on the parcel in a different town, and not re- examine them as havers of these papers. turned till the night of Thursday before the agent does not giye parole evidence in the trial, which circumstance we are in condition
* Even the printed Journals are not, in Engto prove to your lordships; and we have therefore nothing we can legally produce in land, evidence
. 8 How. Mod. St. Tr. 685; addition to the testimony given of their cha- 1 Pbil. Ev. 406. racters. But we have certificates which your of the
counsel for the panel M'Laren ; he was
+ Mr. Grant the proposed witness, was one lordships may perhaps allow to be read.
at the time of this trial a member of the House Lord Justice Clerk.-Not at present; you of Commons,
put it in.
cause, but only gives his testimony to the au- Have you seen him acting in that capacity ? thenticity of a paper in his possession ; that is -I think I have. all that Mr. Grant would be asked to do. Mr. Down to what time did he so act ?-I could Grant can certify, not only that he believes not say. them to be the printed votes of the House of
Walter Andrew sworn.--Examined by Commons, but also that he received them
Mr. Cockburn. under cover from the Vote-office, certifying to him that they are the votes of the House of What are you? A writer ?-Yes. Commons.
Do you know Mr. Baird ?—Yes. Lord Advocate.-The evidence would not be Do you remember the meeting held at Kilcomplete; Mr. Grant can only explain how he marnock in December last?—Yes. came by these papers.
There was a committee for arranging the Lord Justice Clerk.- In a legal sense what
business ?-Yes. Mr. Grant could certify would not make them
Were you a member of it?-Yes.
Was Mr. Baird ?-Yes.. evidence. The question of their being actually the votes of the House would remain to be
You have seen him at the committee ?--I
Do you recollect any discussion' after the Mr. Clerk.- After they are made public, meeting about printing the speeches delivered they are matters of notoriety, which any per- there? Two or three days after the meeting sons may refer to before your lordships. Mr. Baird called on me with the manuscript
Lord Advocute. - I admit my belief of their of a speech which was delivered there. I said genuineness.
I thought indecorous expressions were in it, John Andrews sworn.-Examined by Mr.
which ought to be kept out. He urged that
objection at a meeting ; but the objection Jeffrey for Mr. Baird.
was overruled. Are you chief magistrate of Kilmarnock ?-- What were the precise expressions which you Yes.
called indecorous or vulgar? Do you rememWere you in that office in December last? - ber the expressions ?-I could not repeat the Yes.
words: the passage was the same in the maDo you recollect a public meeting in the nuscript, as in the printed pamphlet, where I Dean-park ?—I do.
read, “ which he is bound to do by the constiDid you receive any notice or application tutional laws of the country; but should he be regarding that meeting ?-I think I did ; one so infatuated as to turn a deaf ear to their or two days before it took place.
just petition, he has forfeited that allegiance, Who waited upon you ?–Mr. Baird met me Yes ! my fellow-townsmen, in such a case to in the street, and told me of the meeting a few - with allegiance." days before.
What was it you objected to ?-What I have What did he state to you ? --That he was read. appointed by the committee to wait on me, to And Mr. Baird concurred in that objection. inform me the meeting would take place if I but he was out-voted ?-Yes. would allow it, and that if I would not he Was there any other speech, to the printing would give up the intention of holding it; I of which he objected ? -The last in the pamsaid I did not approve of the meeting, but I phlet; the speech of Mr. Kennedy, thought I could not prevent it.
What was his objection to Kennedy's speech? Was it a numerous meeting ?-I could noi ; -He said it was nonsense. say, I was not there.
Did he object to any of the others ? To Does it consist with your knowledge that part of Mr. Burt's. the conduct of those at the meeting was What was the objection to it ?- He said it orderly or otherwise ? - There was nothing of would have been better if it had been clothed riot or disturbance that I heard of.
in milder language. No breach of the peace ?-None.
From your conversation with him, did you Have there been any since?— I know of understand him to be the author of that speech? Bone; I recollect none.
-No. He expressed regret that some of it Was there any kind of disturbance recently was not expressed in milder language. before?-In September, I believe.
- Did you ever hear him express a desire to You are acquainted with Mr. Baird ?-Yes, have every thing done quietly, so as to give I have been long acquainted with him. offence to nobody?-Yes.
He is in a respectable way of life ?–Very Was there any riot at the meeting !--Not respectable.
that I heard of. Is he a quiet and peaceable person, or Did he ever express to you any desire that tumultuous and disorderly?-Always peace- government should be overawed ?-No. able.
He wished regularity of proceeding ?-He · Does it consist with your knowledge that he said, the only ohject was to petition constituheld a military commission in a volunteer or tionally, so as to give offence to no one. local militia corps ?-I generally understood he What was the object of printing the prowas a captain.
ceedings ?—To defray the expenses incurred.