"It has been admitted that some tithes are illegal, such as those on turf, and the poor man is advised to institute a lawsuit for relief... Are gentlemen serious when they give this advice? or will they point out, how the man who earns five pence a day is to cope with the wealthy Tithe farmer who oppresses him?

"It has been said we should not pay any regard to people in a state of resistance that it would be derogatory to the dignity of Parliament, and that they should apply in proper form. I laugh at this hoity toity kind of language; there can never be a time when it is improper for the Legislature to do justice."

The question was then put for going into the order of the day, (to supersede Mr. Grattan's motion) and it was carried without a division.

On the 29th January, 1788, Mr. Grattan recalled to the memory of the House, the notice, which last Session he had given, of his intention, in the course of the present, to lay before the House a plan for the commutation of Tithes, and better maintenance of the Clergy.-He now gave notice, that it was his determination, as soon as the public business relative to the accounts and

supply should be dispatched, to enter immediately upon the subject of Tithes; and he did not despair of being able to offer to the House a plan perhaps not altogether perfect, but such as the wisdom of Parliament might easily mature into such a system as would give the clergy a more comfortable and more honourable support than they at present possess, without proving in any degree burdensome to the farmer, or cultivator of land-Mr. Grattan saw no difficulty in uniting the interests of the clergyman and farmer, and putting an end for ever to those dissentions, so injurious to both; at present he would not go farther into the subject, because he conceived it could not be investigated, on broad and extensive ground, till after the public business had been gone through.

On the 14th July, 1788, Mr. Grattan ad. dressed the House on the great and interesting question of Tithes.-Mr. Beresford had intended to bring forward a question of considerable importance, but conscious that Mr. Grattan's notice of his motion, on the subject of Tithes, for that day, had excited unusual expectation, he postponed the consideration of his own motion to a future period.

Mr. GRATTAN began by observing, that it was not his intention to surprize the House at present, by introducing so important a subject as that of Tithes." I would prefer," said Mr. Grattan, "submitting the grievances complained of by the peasantry, to a committee, who would examine if they really existed or not.-That such a mode of proceeding would meet with the approbation of the House, I have no doubt, as the committee, by considering the magical error in its true form, would see the necessity of a commutation of Tithes-a commutation that, were I to propose in the first instance, without convincing the House that the peasantry were really distressed-might bring on an opposition that I would wish, if possible, to see avoided on the present momentous subject.-It was a position in politics, as well as in physics, that for the purpose of removing the complaint, it was necessary for the physician to know the nature of the disorder. For this purpose there are many respectable witnesses ready to attend, to prove their allegations, which I am convinced, would show the necessity of a reformation being made in the mode of provision for the clergy.-I therefore move, That a Committee be appointed to inquire, whether any just cause of discontent exists among the people of the province of

n

i Munster, or of the counties of Kilkenny or Carlow, on account of Tithe, or the collection of Tithes, and if any, to report the same, with their opinion thereupon,'

In this Committee I shall state, and bring evidence of the grievances under which the wretched people labour.-In this Committee I shall also submit what occurs to me as the proper remedy. I do not wish, in the first instance, to usher these matters to the House, because, as I said before, I am unwilling to risk the interest of the Clergy-the cause of the Poor-the happiness of the country, upon my opinion.-Let me then beseech an inquiry, from which much good, and no mischief whatever can possibly result.""

The Attorney-General (Mr. Fitzgibbon, af terwards Lord Clare) and colonel Hobart, ob. jected strongly to the mode pointed out by Mr. Grattan.

Mr. GRATTAN immediately rose, and spoke as follows:

Sir, the people in the South have grievances, and one of their principal grievances is Tithe-do not take it upon my authority, go into a committee. It has been said, in defence of clerical exactions, that though sometimes exorbi

tant, they have never been illegal, I deny it; and will produce proof at your bar, that exactions in some of the disturbed parts have been not exorbitant only, but illegal likewise. I will prove that, in many instances, Tithe bas been demanded, and paid for turf; that Tithe of turf has been assessed at one or two shillings a house like Hearth-money; and in addition to Hearth-money, with this difference, that in case of Hearth-money, there is an exemption for the poor of a certain description; but here, it is the poor of the poorest order, that is, the most resistless people, who pay. I will prove to you, that men have been excommunicated by a most illegal sentence, for refusing to pay tithe of turf. I have two decrees in my hand from the Vicarial Court of Clyne; the first excommunicating one man, the second excommunicating four men, most illegally, most arbitrarily, for refusing to pay tithe of turf: nor has tithe of turf, without pretence of law or custom, been a practice only; but in some part of the South, it has been a formed exaction with its own distinct and facetions appellation, the familiar denomination of Smoak-money, A right to tithe of turf has been usurped against law, and a legislative power of commutation has been exercised, I