racks for 421 men, cost 34,4561. being at the rate of 821. for each man and horse. Edinburgh cavalry barracks for 406 men, cost but 31,870l. being only at the rate of 781. for every man and horse, whereas in the plan before them, the expence would be at the rate of 4001. for every man and horse, this was an excess that no difference in the price of materials then and now could at all explain or account for. It was, he contended, a total departure from all economical honest principles, and from all controul, and as such he disapproved of the whole business. Gentlemen should take into the consideration of the question, the heavy burdens which were imposed upon the people; there was, assuredly, no period when it was more necessary to do so. The last paper which had been put into the hands of the members of that House, ought to render them more particularly cautious in adding to a pressure already so severe. It appeared that of 98 millions of money, which now constituted the annual expenditure of the country, five millions had been added since last year; and there was an addition of not less than the enormous sum of 55 millions since the commencement of the war. Besides, great as were the estimates for the current year, he was confident that they would be exceeded by the expences of it, and he would beg further to remind the House, that our funded debt was not less than 817 millions, while our unfunded debt amounted to fifty four. He was influenced by no party feeling in what he had uttered, and would conclude, by moving, "That the further consideration of the Report be postponed to that day six months." Some conversation took place on the effect of such an Amendment on the part of the Report not objected to, Mr. Fremantle consented to withdraw his Amendment, and another was moved at the suggestion of Mr. Bankes, substituting the sum of 434,000l. for the original sum of 524,000l. which the House was called on to vote. General Tarleton objected to the erection of barracks at Liverpool, upon the ground of that town being by no means situated in the direct line to Ireland; and as it was important to preserve the intercourse with that country as closely as possible, he thought the most natural course of communication would be by the way of Portsmouth and Plymouth to the Cove of Cork, a course which would be peculiarly advantageous; first, from the march of the troops from Kent and Sussex, the two principal military counties of England, being much less circuitous to the last-mentioned places than to Liverpool, and next, from the great facility of debarkation between Kinsale and Cork, from the peculiar boldness of the shores. He then adverted to the local objections to the erection of barracks at Everton, and suggested the propriety, if it was determined to erect barracks at Liverpool, to select some place less objectionable to the inhabitants. -A number of villas had been built on the adjacent grounds, and it was a favourite spot, to which the merchants and mariners of Liverpool retired after weathering the storms of life. Mr. C. Smith thought that the profusion of the proposed grant had been unanswerably shewn by the hon. gentleman who moved the amendment. He himself did know of the scandalous jobs in the erection of barracks at Bath; and with re gard to the scite of the proposed barracks at Liverpool, it was very likely that a beautiful view for the officers might enter into the plans of those who suggested them. The expence of the barracks at Bath was much greater than in any other instance, but the new barracks at Marylebone would cost four times as much. If the House assented to such profusion, they must labour under the grossest delusion with regard to the feelings of the people on the subject of our expences.-A man could hardly enter a stage-coach, but the first questions which he heard were, "How is the country to go on with our present expences? How is the loan of the present year to be made?" and other enquiries of a similar kind. In the present depressed state of our manufactures and commerce, no one circumstance so much aggravated the feelings of the people from one end of the kingdom to the other, as the system of extravagant expenditure that was pursued. The Chancellor of the Exchequer seemed to lament it; and it really would appear that he had not the means of its prevention, but must conform to the wishes of those in a higher quarter. The last ministry had given pledges, and had shewn some disposition towards re trenchment; and he really believed that this was one cause why they had existed so short a time. Financial extravagance had been the destruction of all modern governments; the first disturbances of the French Revolution had been occasioned by the unbounded profusion of the Frenck princes; and ministers should recollect, that he was the best friend to the stability of the government who suffered no opportunity to pass of recommending economy. The apathy of the Houses on subjects of this nature was really astonishing. They were become like extravagant spendthrifts, who durst not look their affairs in the face, and the deeper they plunged in difficulties became more indifferent as to the future. It was his opinion, that at the present rate of expence, two or three years would certainly put an end to the system. Yet with such things staring us in the face, the most profuse and unnecessary expences were recommended. The only way to obtain a solid peace was to shew our potent enemy, that, by a system of retrenchment, we were able to carry on the war to an indefinite period. Mr. Bathurst contended, that it was highly necessary to erect barracks at Bristol; first, with a view of relieving the innkeepers from the burdens they had to encounter by the number of soldiers who were continually quartered on them, and next on account of there being 5,000 French prisoners confined within four miles of the city. General Gascoyne said, the objections of the inhabitants of Liverpool were, not to the erection of barracks, but to the place selected for that purpose; which was one inhabited by the most respectable people of Liverpool, who did not object to the soldiers, having no doubt of their discipline, but to the people who sold liquor, soldier's wives, and such description of persons as generally settled in the neighbourhood of troops. He intimated, however, that the commander in chief had expressed his readiness to meet their wishes, by the abandonment of San Domingo, provided any spot equally eligible could be procured. Mr. Wrottesley said the House ought well to consider, if it were necessary to erect the barracks at all. It was said the inn-keepers would be released by the measure, but did gentlemen consider what a permanent expence these would entail on the country? If happily a peace were made to morrow, these would still be an expence to the country. Might it not then be better to give the inn-keepers some compensation for the inconveniences to which they were subjected. If quartering the soldiers in Bristol would be too far from the French prisoners in that neigh bourhood, why, he would ask, was Bristol, a seaport, selected for a depôt for French prisoners? It had been stated on a former evening, that one of the reasons for erecting barracks in Mary-le-bone-park was, that if any disturbance should arise in the metropolis, they might be called out to crush it immediately. He admitted that government should have the means of putting down a riot at once, but with a view to effect this, was it necessary to have the military actually in the metropolis. What were the barracks at Houn slow, &c. for? We had a sufficient number of troops within two, or at most three hours march of the metropolis, to quell any such tumult. If the barracks were to be erected at all, he thought they ought to be built on a more economical plan than had been proposed. Were the barracks intended to ornament Mary-le-bone Park? There was no reason why the public money should be squandered away imprudently for the purpose of ornamenting this or that park. It seemed now to be wished to separate the military altogether from the people. Why else were there so many barracks erected, and the military colleges of Marlow and Sandhurst established, when the boy who entered at 12 or 13 years of age never could have a common feeling with the other inhabi tants of the country. Upon the whole he thought it would be much better to give the sum proposed for the erection of these barracks in aid of the distressed manufacturers of the country; and he should therefore decidedly vote against the grant. Mr. Wharton supported the original grant. As to the barracks at Bristol and Liverpool, there was no argument made against the necessity of the first, which was at all tenable, and the objection against the other was altogether local. The Commander in Chief allowing its full weight to the Petition of those who did not wish that a barrack should be built on the scite of San Domingo, near Liverpool, had given two months time to the applicants to find out a situation instead of it: and there was not certainly the least desire on the part of government to build on that scite, if one equally convenient could be had. As to the arguments of the hon. gentleman who spoke against the principle of barracks altogether, he should like to know from the hon. gentleman if it were possible by any enchantment, to do away at once all the barracks in the country, did he imagine that the troops could distant manner to the prices current at both periods. At the former period timber was at 31. and now it was at 137. and other articles were nearly in proportion. He concluded his observations with a few remarks on the plan for building the barracks proposed by Mr. Nash. Mr. Nash said, that by a judicious arrangement, a what was this arrangement of Mr. Nash, who he allowed to be a man of genius and fancy in his profession, though his talent was not particularly exerted in behalf of the soldiers on this occasion? Why, that all the nuisances belonging to such a place as the barracks were to be in the very midst of the barracks themselves. After saying this, he thought he would be excused from arguing more at length on the judicious arrangement of Mr. John Nash. Mr. Nash was said to be in the habit of building very ornamental houses for gentlemen; but if he treated gentlemen as he would the soldiers, he could not well account for his press of business in this ornamental way. Mr. Bankes spoke in favour of altering and reducing the present estimate. He said that he for one could not agree to vote away any sum at the present moment that could by possibility be avoided. He was convinced there were so many very heavy expences coming upon us from various be quartered in the same way in which they were quartered before those barracks existed? The hon. gentleman knew that was impossible; and it was, therefore, unfair in him to advance such an argument. As to the proposed barracks at Mary-le-bone, that subject divided itself into two considerations,-1st, whether the barracks were necessary; and, 2dly, whe-saving of one-third might be made; but ther the plan proposed was the most proper to be adopted. As to the necessity, he considered it absolutely imperious; and he, therefore, should not waste the time of the House in making out that which was evident to every one; but the other consideration was one of detail, and to be met by calculation. The hon. gentleman who opened the debate had said, that the estimate of 133,000l. would not cover the whole expences, as the value of the ground, 35,000l. was to be added to that estimate. But did not the hon. gentleman know, that if the government were to purchase ground for those barracks, there would be incurred an actual expence of nearly the same sum? He did not wish to deny that the sum proposed was an enormous onebut at a rough calculation, he contended that it was impossible to build cavalry barracks at a smaller expence. It was said, that the plan adopted was more expensive than that on which the Hyde Park barracks were built. Now the fact was, that the model of both was the same, with the ex-quarters which must be attended to, that ception of one particular, which went in favour of Mary-le-bone barracks, and that was, that in the latter, there would be a parade; which would serve at the same time, for an exercising ground, while at present, government was at great expence for an exercising ground to serve for the troops at Hyde Park. It was asked by another hon. gentleman, was there not a sufficient number of barracks within two or three hours' march of London in case of any insurrection or disturbance: but he had to inform that hon. gentleman, that the barracks at Mary-le-bone were to be built on the principle of a depot [Hear, hear, from sir F. Burdett and other members.] He did not know what there was in this observation to excite the cheers of the gentlemen opposite. He then argued against the unfairness of the estimate brought forward by the hon. mover of the amendment. When that hon. gentleman made the comparison that he did between the expence of the former barracks and the estimate for the present, it was rather uncandid, not to allude even in the most the utmost economy in every department of our expenditure was absolutely necessary; and he would not do any thing that might give a check to our exertions in the peninsula. If the country was to be burdened with large additional sums, let them be applied to carrying on the war in the peninsula. This was, in his opinion, a very bad time to build expensive barracks when timber was at so high a price and it might, from various circumstances, be reasonably hoped, that in a short time a great alteration would take place. He was sure there was a very great profusion in the estimate of the present barracks, and he saw no necessity for building the officers' lodgings in the barracks, General Phipps having heard it observed, that the officers did not need to be accommodated in the barracks, thought that officers ought always to be lodged along with the men, otherwise they might easily be intercepted, on any emergency, in going separately from their homes. Sir J. Newport wishe to ask the hon. general, whether the officers of the foot guards were quartered along with the men? | and whether he had ever heard of any inconvenience having resulted from their not being so quartered? General Phipps had to answer the right hon. baronet that it would be much better if they were. Mr. Creevey observed, that though the valuable lease of 548 acres of Mary-lebone Park had fallen into the crown within the last year, and there had been no report from the surveyor-general of the land revenue of the crown since that of Mr. Fordyce, in 1809, yet that no report had been made this session. This was a breach of the act of the 50th of the King, which directed such reports to be laid before parliament every three years. It was the duty of lord Glenbervie to have furnished the history of these crown lands; and he was the more disinclined to leave the management of these matters to his lordship, whom, he saw, was proprietor in a new canal, called the Regent's Canal, about to be cut in this very Mary-le-bone Park. Lord Glenbervie, he observed, by a clause in the Bill, had given himself, as surveyor-general of the land revenues of the crown, a power to contract with lord Glenbervie, as proprietor of the Regent's Canal [Here the hon. gentleman read the clause empowering the sale of part of the crown lands for the purposes of the Canal.] His lordship had also issued cards to the members of the House, to come down on Tuesday, at three o'clock, to support the Bill, and to assure all those who chose to join him of 11 per cent. for their money. Indeed so busy did he appear to be with his canal, he had not had time to make his report. On these grounds he wished for further enquiry, before he voted the money now asked for. He also objected to the scite chosen for the barracks at Liverpool, and contended that the other side of the town was more eligible. Sir Mark Wood supported the original Resolution, and had no hope of any time coming more fit than the present, for executing works, in his opinion, absolutely indispensable. He contended for the necessity of having barracks near town for the guards, who could not remain in the stables they possessed any longer, and were liable to all the evils and inconveniencies attendant on being billetted in public-houses, two or three miles from their horses. He also maintained, that the expence incurred would not be more than the men now cost in various other ways, with inn-keepers' allowances, &c. Barracks also separated them from the contagion of vice, so injurious to discipline in populous sea-ports, such as Liverpool and Bristol. Mr. Wynn concurred generally with Mr. Bankes, as to the unfitness of the time, and the barracks not being now absolutely necessary. His great objection was to the enormous expenditure, and he appre. hended no danger to the horse guards, from their remaining in the same situation in which they had been for the last century. Mr. Bastard said, the barracks built 50 years ago were more comfortable for the men, more convenient for discipline, and more durable than those built of late years at greater expence. Till the cause of this was enquired into, he wished the present vote to be postponed. Sir F. Burdett said, that he felt it less necessary to address the House, from the conviction he entertained of the truth of the assertion of the Secretary of the Treasury, that he should be able to persuade the majority of the House that the vote ought to be acceded to. On this subject, however, involving a question of the highest constitutional importance, he could not consent to give a silent vote. On former occasions, in addressing the House upon this subject, he had been accused of disaffection, because he had asserted, that the government was attempting to make use of that army which was paid by the people for the subjugation of the people. The truth of this statement the vote now proposed made evident, and some of its supporters even went so far as to urge the necessity of concurring in it, lest the soldiers should be intercepted by the populace whom they were to subdue, on the way to their horses. [Hear! hear! from ministers.] He had no doubt his remarks were not very welcome to the other side of the House, whose business it was, with inconsistent prodigality, to throw away the public money with one hand, while they were grinding the nation with taxation with the other. At a time when discontents convulsed the country when ministers felt their weakness, and required support other than that of the people, that was indeed the fit period for establishing a military system for their protection, by the erection of barracks to keep down the national spirit in all the populous districts. Much was said of the hateful tyranny of Buonaparté, but was not the mode now pursued not only following his steps, but even outrunning him in the formation of a military despotism, to govern the people, not by law, but by the sword? Were not the soldiers on the slightest occasions called in to keep down the people? Did they not commit murders upon the people? [Order! order! order!] This was indeed a new, and an auspicious æra [Order!] Gentlemen might make what exclamations they pleased, but they should not drown his voice, which was only uttering the truth. General Manners spoke to order. He said that to assert that what the hon. baronet was stating was the truth, was casting an undeserved slur upon the army. Sir F. Burdett denied that he was making any accusation against those who were compelled to act under the orders of their superiors. It was the administration of the country that he charged with employing the army to commit murders. General Manners desired that the hon. baronet's words might be taken down. guards, she pointed to the people in the streets, and said, "These are my guards, and by their affections I am best protected." The ministers, however, now might think proper to tell the Prince Regent that he was safe only when surrounded with soldiers. It would be found however, by referring to history, that those sovereigns were more secure, and more beloved who relied on their people, than those who relied on armies. Who brought Charles 1 to the block? It was an army, and an army levied by parliament, but which afterwards turned out the same parliament. Who restored Charles 2?-An army-asmall part of Cromwell's army. Nevertheless Charles 2 wished to rely upon them, but a wiser man than he (lord Clarendon) dissuaded him from it. James 2 wished also to rely on a regular army, but they deserted him in his distress. He would maintain that as the law now stood, the magistrates were not justified in letting the soldiery loose upon the people, and giving them up to military execution. The Riot Act allowed the constitutional officers, sheriffs, constables, &c. to interfere, and justified those constitttional officers in using force, if the populace would not disperse in a certain time after reading the act. The Riot Act did not prescribe that the soldiery should be ordered to fire upon unarmed multitudes, in order to disperse them. He conceived that the expence of these barracks would be a great objection in the present times, but it was on the unconstitutional tendency of the measure that he rested his principal objection to it. Sir F. Burdett said, that he had no objection to any of his words being taken down; but as the hon. general had called him to order without attempting to shew how he was out of order, and expressed a wish that his words should be taken down without moving for it regularly, he thought that it was rather the words of the hon. general which ought to be taken down. He would maintain that the act which was relied on, called the Riot Act, did not say any thing about soldiers, or authorise the magistrates to employ them as they had done, or give up a starving population to The Chancellor of the Exchequer was firmly military execution. When he heard the convinced, that however the question might Secretary to the Treasury argue, that it be disposed of, or whatever might be thought was a vicious system to keep the soldiers of the details of it, there would be very few out of barracks, or to allow any free inter- persons found either in the House or in the course between them and the people, he country to follow the hon. baronet in his could not but observe how totally the con- argument, or to concur in a single sentistitutional opinions of our ancestors had ment which the hon, baronet had uttered. been departed from in the present times. He believed that the hon, baronet was exSuch doctrines would have filled our fore-tremely mistaken, if he supposed that the fathers with horror and affright, and against such sentiments he must ever protest. Was it in this new era that the Prince Regent was to be told by his ministers, that the foundations of the British throne ought not to rest in the affections of the people, but on an army? At former periods of our history, and in the most successful reigns, such had not been the policy of the country. When Queen Elizabeth was asked by the Spanish minister, where were her speech which he had just delivered was likely to make any great impression out of the House, or that he would be considered as acting under a sound discretion, wheu at this period above all others-when his mind could not fail to be impressed with the disgraceful scenes that every day occurred in a particular part of the kingdom, the hon. baronet held out to the people that those measures, the employment of which cruel necessity compelled, were re |