of his finding fault with his conduct. Certainly they were not in habits of political friendship. It was impoffible that they thould be fo, and he would tell the honourable gentleman when they ceafed to continue in fuch habits. On an occafion the moft malignant that human depravity could exercife its baseft inveteracy upon; when a motion was made to with-hold the government of Greenwich Hofpital from a brave fea officer, who had been wounded in the fervice of his country, and who had fpent many years in that fervice with the greatest honour, but who happening by one political act to difplease a party, had been not only profcribed by that party, but perfecuted with the moft unremitting vengeance. Pitt. Mr. W. Pitt fpoke to order, and faid, if the honourable Mr. W. gentleman would give him leave, he would advife him to poftpone going into fubjects that could not have the leaft relation to the converfation that had been just held, which of itself had been extremely diforderly, but which had been allowed and fubmitted to, because it had been thought neceffary. Governor Johnstone faid, whenever he was attacked by any Governor gentleman, either directly or indirectly, he would always Johnstone, reply in his own defence, and if the Houfe liftened to the one, they ought in juftice to hear the other: but he was far from defiring at any time to perfift in defending himself against their fenfe and inclination. Mr. Burke defired to underftand, what his conduct was Mr. Burke to be with respect to Meffrs. Powell and Bembridge. He was, he conceived, to accept their refignations in compliance with the opinion of the House, and was not to be responsible for the confequences. Mr. Powys was of the opinion, that it was improper Mr. Powys. to prejudge; but he wifhed it to be held as an established principle, that no perfon under profecution fhould, during that profecution, hold any office of trust. Mr. Rolle was fatisfied, and faid, that the accepted refig- Mr. Rolle. nation of the two officers would make his motion unne ceffary. Mr. Burke repeated that he was not in that cafe to be con- Mr. Burke, fidered refponfible for the confequences, in the delays of office which their refignation would occafion. Mr. Kenyon gave notice, that when the legal process was Mr. Ken determined, he should move for the minutes of the Treasury, yon. meaning to ground a motion on thofe minutes. Mr. Kenyon defired to fet Mr. Rigby right in one particular. Mr. VOL. X. I Powell Mr. Baker.. Powell was not now proceeded against in his character of an Executor to a noble Lord who was no more, but in his public character of Cashier of the Pay Office. A civil fuit indeed would be commenced against him in his character of Executor to the late Lord Holland. Mr. Baker mifunderftanding Mr. Kenyon's notice, was beginning to reafon upon the contradiction exemplified in its being on the fame day declared, that the matter fhould now reft quoad that Houfe, and that it was to be revived in another fhape hereafter; when he was fet right by Mr. Kenyon. Lord John Lord John Cavendish faid, if when the trial at law was deCavendish. cided, the learned gentleman meant to revive the business, he might do it; but he could not help faying, that his opinions never had been very much in favour of the House; and a part of it had lowered itself confiderably in his judgment by the conduct pursued on the bufinefs that had been fo much agitated. Mr. Arden. Mr, Dau beny. Mr. Gaf- Mr. Arden was warmed by this remark, and rose with some heat to exculpate himself from being comprehended within its fcope. He declared that he had been actuated by public motives, and no other. At length the converfation was put an end to by Mr. W. S. Stanhope moving that a new writ be iffued for Newton, in Lancashire, in the room of Thomas Peter Legh, Efq. who had accepted of an Enfigncy of foot. CUSTOM-HOUSE REFORM BILL. The order of the day being upon motion read, for the fecond reading of the Custom Houfe bill, and the Speaker putting the question," that this bill be now read a fecond time, Mr. Daubeny moved, that it be deferred for three months, and gave his reafons for the motion, but in fo low a tone of voice that we could not hear his argument, farther than that the bill in his mind, inftead of producing economy would be productive of expence, Mr. Gascoigne, junr. feconded the motion, and objected ftrongly to the principles of the bill; he infifted that it was cruel to take away the places of the deputies to patent offices, as they were by no means finecure places, and there were many other circumftances to which he could not bring himself to agree, as they militated strongly both against juftice and generofity. He defcribed the bill as liable to many objections, as well with regard to its principle, as to the various claufes it contained. Hav 1 Having a good deal to fay with refpect to the latter, he declared he would not then take up much of the time of the House, but would referve his objections to the claufes till the bill was in a Committee, (if it fhould be the fenfe of the majority that it ought to be fent to one) and fhould that be the cafe, after it had gone through the Committee, and received as much correction and improvement as a Committee could give it, he would then trouble the House with a few arguments against its principle, which he could by no means confider as fit to be adopted. One remark he would then make, to prove how highly objectionable it was in an effential particular. If it paffed as it ftood, a fevere injury, as he had faid, would be done to a body of men, against whom ro crime had been proved, and against whom no crime could, he was perfuaded, be alledged. He meant the deputies to the holders of patents places, many of whom were not appointed by the patentees, but all of whom, without a colour of reafon, or a pretext of juftice, would be deprived of their livelihood, and have to, feck to earn their bread, by means which they were yet to learn. Mr. Gafcoigne defcribed the deputies of the patentees as a fet of honest, induftrious, deferving individuals, many of whom had spent the greater part of their lives in the public fervice, had always borne refpectable characters, had proved themselves men of unimpeachable integrity, and had uniformly acted in such a manner as to entitle them to the protection of Parliament. To turn thefe men adrift without a provifion of any kind, was, he faid, as inhumane as it was unjuft; if therefore the bill fhould fo far meet with the fanction of the House, as to be allowed to go to a Committee, he hoped, that in the Committee he fhould be permitted to introduce a clause to cure this alarming defect, and render it in that particular at lefs objectionable. With regard to the prin ciple of the bill, Mr. Gascoigne faid, he would for the prefent only observe, that it appeared to him to be a bill which would tend in a very great degree to diminish the influence of the Crown, the queftion naturally therefore would result, whether the Houfe thought that the influence of the Crown ought to be more diminished than it, was or not? That queftion, however, he would not then enlarge upon, but would content himfelf with feconding the amendment of the honourable gentleman near him. Mr. Minchin was of the fame opinion, and infifted that the bill would, fo far from acting as an economical bill, be I 2 quite Mr.Ambler Mr. Holdfworth. Mr.W.Pitt. quite the reverfe; for the compenfation that must be given to thofe perfons, whofe places would be taken away, would 'be a fresh means of burthening the fubject with new taxes. Mr. Ambler was of the fame opinion; he faid, that the propofition, of abolishing certain patent offices, and making the patentees a compenfation, was not only putting the public to a very confiderable and unneceffary expence, but juft the very worst way that could poffibly be taken, to effect a reform, if a reform in that particular were neceffary. The obvious mode of abolishing patent places, Mr. Ambler faid, would have been the way that had been uniformly adopted in the preceeding bill of reform, namely, enacting that the prefent holders of them fhould continue to poffefs them while they lived, but that after their deaths no more patents should be granted. He alfo fhewed, that according to the prefent bill, the influence, the power, and the revenue of the Commiffioners of Cuftoms would be very greatly increased; a circumftance by no means to be defired. Mr. Holdsworth spoke in favour of the bill, and thought. it extremely neceffary, as the prefent enormous fees paid by merchants rendered it very expenfive to expedite business. Mr. W. Pitt faid, he trufted that gentlemen would allow his motives for bringing in the bill were juft, and that the principle of the bill was good, however objectionable fome of the claufes might be; therefore the faireft way would be to let it go to a Committee, and then the claufes would be fairly argued, and fuch alterations as might be thought neceffary would be made; he was certain, he faid, that the bill was not perfect, therefore he fhould be happy in every affil tance gentlemen would give him; but the fees taken at the Cuftom-houfe were enormous, burthenfome to trade, and ferved in a great measure as covers for corruption. That the compenfation to be made to perfons whofe offices would be taken away, muft certainly add to the prefent burthens of the fubject; yet gentlemen ought to confider whether it would not be much better to have a temporary burthen, than a continuance of the prefent enormous practice. He defired to know, if any man would be hardy enough to declare, that perfons holding patent places, ought not to do the duty of thofe places, or give up their patents? Or would any man fay, that if it were true that exorbitant fees were taken, many of them arbitrarily fettled, fuch fees ought not to be abolished? With regard to the objections that he heard that day, they were fuch as might be obviated. One gentleman had had advised that the patents now in exiftence, should con- plified, The Lord |