AN. 31, 1832.]

Apportionment Bill.

[H. OF R.

Carolina, 36,823; South Carolina, 59,351; Kentucky, I do not, of course, insist on an equalization which would 3,625; and Tennessee, 30,771; amounting to 277,091. produce such disastrous results to Pennsylvania; my only Now, it must be obvious to all, that, in fixing the pre-object being to show to what the rule of equal and exact ent ratio, justice requires that the fractions to the States justice would lead, in regard to Pennsylvania, if it were, us burdened during the last ten years should be dimi- in the nature of things, practicable for any apportionished as much as possible. By retaining the ratio of ment to carry it into full effect. But I may be permitted 8,000, they will indeed be diminished to 195,543. But a to put it to Pennsylvanians, whether they can rest quietly atio of 44,000 will still further reduce them to 147,543. | for ten years to come upon a fraction of 4,072, while the Thus it will be seen that a ratio of 44,000 reduces the States of Vermont, New Jersey, and Kentucky, with five normous amount of the fractions of these eight States less representatives on this floor than Pennsylvania, will, 8,000 below the reduction which would be effected by at a ratio of 48,000, have unrepresented fractions to the ratio of 48,000. Is not this worthy of consideration? amount of 118,411; and that, too, succeeding an amount Now let us see the effect of these two ratios upon Penn- of fractions endured by them for the previous ten years, ylvania. In 1820, with a population of 1,049,313, she of 103,944! ad a fraction of only 9,478. "Equal and exact justice" Permit me now, Mr. Speaker, to take another view of bviously requires that the fraction of Pennsylvania should this subject. The ratio proposed in the bill will have the ow be increased. But, sir, what will be the effect of a effect of depriving four of the States of this Union of one 8,000 ratic upon that State? Why, instead of increasing of each of the representation they now have in this body. er fraction, it actually diminishes it more than half--re- I refer to the States of New Hampshire, Massachusetts, ducing it to 4,072! Yes, sir, while eight States of this Maryland, and Virginia. Union, with a population, under the late census, of 3,315,543, will have fractions to the amount of 195,543, Pennsylvania, with a population of 1,348,072, will have a fraction of but 4,072!

The time may come, indeed, it must come, in the progressive increase of our population, when that represen tation will be diminished in order to preserve this House within the maximum which necessarily limits the number Does not every man involuntarily exclaim, is there not of all deliberative assemblies. But until that time arrives, some way by which we may approximate nearer to jus- we may properly yield--nay, we are bound to yield, to the tice than this? I answer, there is. Strike out 48,000 appeals which these old and paternal States make, when from the bill, and insert 44,000. This will do justice. It they earnestly ask that their representation may remain will increase the fraction of Pennsylvania 24,000, making undiminished. More especially should these appeals be it amount to 28,072, while it will diminish the amount of regarded, when a proposed ratio will have the effect not fractions in the eight States, 48,000, reducing them, as only of producing a succession of losses of representation we have seen, to 147,543. Now, sir, is not this right? Can in particular sections of the country, but will, moreover, Pennsylvania, honest Pennsylvania, object to it? Never, be accompanied with a large accumulation of fractions in sir; never, until, from the name of her noble common- the same sections. wealth, she is prepared to expunge the name of its immortal founder.

Now, sir, what will be the effect, in these respects, of the ratio proposed in the bill? By the apportionment unI said, sir, that a ratio of 44,000 will do justice to Penn-der the census of 1820, Vermont and Connecticut in the sylvania. I was mistaken; for, with the fraction of 28,000 East, and Delaware and Virginia in the centre, lost, each, which that ratio will give her, she will still have less, by one representative. By adopting a ratio of 48,000, New about 50,000, than her just proportion. How is this? The Hampshire and Massachusetts, Maryland and Virginia, will eight States I have mentioned, have a population of lose four more representatives. Nor is this all. In the for3,315,543. The amount of their fractions at a ratio of mer apportionment, Vermont and Connecticut, Delaware 48,000 is 195,543. To make the unrepresented popula. and Virginia, were left with fractions amounting to 116,000. tion of Pennsylvania bear the same proportion to 195,543, By a ratio of 48,000, New Hampshire and Massachusetts, that her entire population does to that of the eight States, Maryland and Virginia, each of which loses a member upon it should be increased to 77,000 instead of 28,000-that is, that ratio, will now be left also with fractions to the amount 49,000 more than it can be, at a ratio even of " 44." of 99,000. And if to this amount be added the fractions But were Pennsylvania to remain for the next ten years which will be left to Vermont and Delaware, each of unrepresented, even as to 77,000 of her population, which lost a member under the last apportionment, we equality would still not be produced. For it must be re-shall have, in the present apportionment, losses by fracmembered that for ten entire years she has had the enor-tions to the amount of 160,000 in the six Eastern and cenmous advantage over the eight States, of having a fraction tre States, losing members under either the last or present of only 9,478, when, to make it bear a just proportion to apportionment.

the fractions of those States, it should have been 87,658. Thus, under the apportionments of both 1820 and 1830, Thus, for ten years, the unrepresented population of Vermont, New Hampshire, Connecticut, Delaware, MaPennsylvania has been 78,180 less than, upon the princi- ryland, and Virginia, will have lost eight representatives, ple of equality, it should have been. and been burdened with an accumulation of fractions to

Now, sir, as some degree of inequality must, in the na- the amount of 283,000. Two of these losses of representure of things, be produced at any single apportionment tation will have fallen to the lot of Virginia, and one to by every possible ratio, that inequality should, as far as that of Vermont; while the latter State will have borne a practicable, be corrected at the succeeding apportion- disproportionate burden of fractions to the amount of ment. To make the correction perfect, the positions of 76,421. Ought not such a result, if practicable, to be the parties in relation to each other should be reversed avoided? And shall New Hampshire and Vermont, Masfor the succeeding ten years. And what would be the sachusetts, Maryland, and Virginia, appeal in vain, when effect of the application of such a rule to the case I am they ask the adoption of a ratio which, while it will keep considering? It would be to add to 77,000, the amount of this body clearly within reasonable limits as to numbers, unrepresented population that Pennsylvania should have, will materially mitigate the burden which they will be, to place her on an equality with the eight States, 78, 180, otherwise, compelled to sustain?

which she has had less than she should have had during And why, let me ask, on general principles, diminish the last ten years--the result of which would be the dis- the representation of any of the old States, until it shall franchisement, in effect, of 155,180 of her population for become necessary to do so, to keep the number of this the next ten years. Instead of which, she will, if 48,000 body from exceeding the necessary maximum of repreis retained in the bill, have a fraction of only 4,072. sentation? Is there nothing due from our younger bre

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Apportionment Bill.

[JAN. 31, 183

thren--may I not say, our children-in the West, to those to the amount of 100,000 beyond what they would be States whose sacrifices and sufferings purchased the rich a ratio of 44! inheritance they now enjoy? And will they not delight to pour out their noble, generous feelings in the manifestation of a kind regard to the desire of their Eastern brethren to retain an undiminished strength in the councils of the nation? I trust, sir, they will.

Permit me now to dwell a few moments on another feature in the unequal operation of the proposed ratio. The States of Kentucky and Tennessee have a nearly equal population-the latter exceeding the former but 3,431. Their representation obviously ought to be equal. A ratio of 44,000 would make them so. But what will be the effect of the ratio proposed in the bill? Why, sir, it gives to Tennessee thirteen members, while Kentucky will have but twelve. There is no inequality connected with this ratio that even approaches to this, save in two cases. Connecticut, with a population exceeding that of Vermont only about 17,000, will have one more member than Vermont; and North Carolina, with a population exceeding that of Kentucky but about 18,000, will have one more member than the latter State.

I will say nothing, I am sure I need say nothing, awaken the liberal feelings of the West towards the rent States, who now ask that they may be left with a undiminished representation in this body. I could not, I would, add any thing to the eloquent appeals which hav been made to gentlemen from the West, by those wh have preceded me. It has been my purpose to presen facts, which form, in my view, an appeal to their justice and to communicate to their minds the convictions which guide and control the decisions of my own.

And why, sir, permit me to add, should the Western States feel a lingering reluctance to yield the point of adopting a ratio which shall produce upon the Atlantic States the effects I have attempted to describe? Is there any thing in the relative condition and prospects of the East and the West which can produce the slightest jealousy of an undue preponderance in the power of the for mer? Is not the current of events, on the contrary, rapidly bearing the standard of empire beyond the Allegha ny mountains? The States which are spread out in the I cannot, sir, look at this case of Kentucky and Tennes- vast valley of the Mississippi now number a population of see without strong emotion. A difference in population three and one-third millions. At a ratio of 44,000, they of only 3,431 is destined, by the operation of this bill, to will have a representation in this body of 71; and their rate deprive Kentucky, for the succeeding ten years, of about of increase since the census of 1820 has been 67 per cent., one-twelfth of her just representation in this body. Sir, while that of the Atlantic States has been but 23. And a parallel to this injustice cannot be found in the whole how long will it be before those States will control the history of legislation on this subject, from 1792 to the pre- destinies of this great empire? How long before the elder sent time. I have carefully examined the four successive States, like Joseph's father and brethren, will come to bow apportionments, and I challenge the production of a sin- down before the all-controlling power of the "far West?" gle case, whose injustice will bear any comparison with Well, be it so. I have no heart-burnings at their advanthis. Sir, your constituents will say, give to these States ces in prosperity and power. I would not, if I could, an equal representation in this body. My constituents, I arrest their mighty march. I rejoice at the rapidity of its am sure, will say so; and I verily believe the constituents onward course. But, Mr. Speaker, I ask them-and it is of the honorable gentleman from Tennessee, [Mr. POLK,] all I ask-to remember and do justice to the venerated who reported this bill, and so ably advocates it, will say stocks from whence they sprung. So. The whole country will exclaim against the injustice of refusing to do it.

But I am asked, why manifest so much solicitude for Kentucky? Sir, it is because the citizens of that State are my brethren--bound to me and to my constituents by the strong ties of a common interest in a common country; and because my whole soul revolts at the signal injustice which the bill upon your table does to her.

It may be proper here to say that the 22 members which a ratio of "44" will add to the House, beyond that of "48," will be distributed among the several sections of the United States, as follows, viz. To the six Eastern States, with a population of 1,954,000, four--to the five middle States, with a population of 4,062,000, eight--to the four Southern States, with a population of 2,548,000, five-and to the nine Western and Southwestern States, But it is objected that, by a substitution of "44" for with a population of 3,358,000, five--a distribution, it will "48," six of the Western States, viz. Indiana, Illinois, be perceived, which bears a tolerably just proportion to Missouri, Mississippi, Louisiana, and Alabama, will be left the population of the several sections in which it falls. with large fractions. I admit this. Their aggregate frac- Mr. Speaker, allow me to ask the indulgence of the tions, at 44, will be 207,366, greater by 88,000 than they House, while I advert, for a few moments, to another will be at a ratio of 48. But it should be remembered branch of this inquiry. To what extent may the number that the representation of those States will remain the of this body be increased, consistently with the public insame, whether the ratio be "48" or "44." With them, terest? Great apprehensions have been expressed at the then, it is a question of fractions alone, and they may be prospect of such an excess of numbers, as ultimately to supposed to give importance to this consideration, from a render the business of legislation impracticable; and six, regard which the West may justly have to the relative seven, and eight hundred have been presented to us as examount of its unrepresented population. But how does amples of such excess. But what is the real question now the entire West stand in relation to this matter? The frac- before us? It is, whether two hundred and fifty-nine is tions of the six States I have mentioned will, indeed, by an excessive number, either for the convenient and expe falling from a ratio of 48 to 44,000, be increased 88,000. ditious transaction of business, or as an adequate repre But, by the same operation, the fractions of the three re-sentation of the interests and wishes of thirteen millions of maining Western States, Ohio, Kentucky, and Tennessee, people. This is the question. Whenever a proposition will be diminished 44,000. So that the nett loss of frac- shall be made to enlarge this assembly to a number far in tions to the whole of the nine Western and Southwestern advance of that now proposed, it will then be time to urge States, by the substitution of 44 for 48, will be but 44,000; the objections applicable to an excess of numbers. averaging about 5,000 only to each of those States. Now, sir, what real evils may be expected to result from I now ask gentlemen to look at the effect which this an augmentation of this body to two hundred and fifty. paltry saving of 5,000 in the average fractions of the West-nine? I pass over, because it has been sufficiently anern States, by retaining the ratio of 48,000, will have upon swered, the objection founded upon the supposed imprac the Atlantic States. It will force upon New Hampshire, ticability of properly conducting the business of legislation Massachusetts, Maryland, and Virginia, a loss of four of in so large an assembly; and will advert, for a few mo their present representation, while it will increase the ments, to another objection.

fractions of those States, and of Vermont and Kentucky, | It is said that delays will result from any considerable

JAN. 31, 1882.]

Apportionment Bill.

[H. of R.

and naval, in the service of the United States, on the 30th of September, 1829," prepared in pursuance of a resolution of Congress adopted in April, 1816. That resolution requires the compilation of this register at the Department of State, and its delivery to the members of the two Houses on the first Monday of January succeeding the commencement of each Congress. A due compliance with this requisition would have enabled me to ascertain, more perfectly than I now can, the present extent of the patronage exercised under the appointing power.

increase of the number of this body; that it is even now "a register of all the officers and agents, civil, military, too numerous for a legislative assembly; and that the prompt despatch of the public business would be greatly facilitated by its reduction. There exists, sir, in my view, a total misapprehension on this subject. The delays complained of are not chargeable to an excess of numbers. They result from the nature and extent of the subject of your legislation. What are they? They embrace within their wide and comprehensive range, your foreign relations--your army-your navy--your fortifications-your commerce and manufactures--your finances--your public lands your Indian relations-your Post Office Department--and the claims of your revolutionary soldiers, and others; besides various other matters of greater or less general interest, which are constantly urged upon the consideration of Congress. And all this connected with the endlessly diversified interests of thirteen millions of people, spread over an extent of territory greater than the entire continent of Europe--delays! Why, sir, who does not see in all this, causes of protracted legislation, over which any limitation of numbers could have and ought to have no control--causes which would operate with equal force, whether our numbers be one hundred or three hundred?

From the best sources of information thus within my reach, it appears that there are in the service of the United States, connected with its foreign department, agents of various grades, to the number of about one hundred and seventy: in the various branches of the Treasury Department, including the collectors and inspectors of the customs, with their subordinates, and the surveyors, clerks, registers, and receivers, connected with the public lands, about one thousand five hundred and fifty; and in the Post Office Department, including mail contractors, about ten thousand: the whole amounting to about eleven thousand seven hundred and twenty. From the same sources, it appears that the aggregate compensation to the various But I am asked, what are the positive advantages of a officers and agents embraced in this enumeration, exceeds numerous representation in this body? I take the broad the sum of three million two hundred thousand dollars ground, in the first place, that a large representation here annually. The number of officers and agents of various is necessary to maintain our republican institutions in their grades, in the War and Navy Departments, is about two purity and vigor. Sir, this is the people's Government. thousand five hundred-the aggregate of whose compenRecognising no "divine right" in any man or set of men sations I have not been able, with as much precision as in to govern them, "the people of the United States" have the other departments, to ascertain, but which, it is beordained and established the constitution under which we lieved, may be safely estimated at a sum not less than one are now acting. The strength of this Government is in million eight hundred thousand dollars. public opinion--in the confidence and attachment of the It thus appears that there are connected with the five people. Would you give to it stability and permanency? Executive Departments of this Government more than Strengthen that confidence and attachment, by every fourteen thousand officers and agents of various grades, means in your power. Bring the Government, through the aggregate of whose compensations amounts to the sum a numerous representation here, as near to the people as of about five millions of dollars annually. possible. The farther it is removed from them, the weaker Now, sir, let it be remembered that all this vast amount becomes the bond which binds them to it, and the more of patronage is either directly or indirectly at the disposal controlling the tendencies which twenty-four State Go- of one man-exercised agreeably to the dictates of his own vernments are unceasingly exerting in an opposite direc-will, and independent of the people's immediate repretion. I would not, if I could, enlarge the powers now sentatives in this body. And so far as they may be disconferred on this Government by the constitution. Upon posed to exert an influence against its abuse, the very a fair and just construction of that instrument, they are power which it confers may be exerted to seduce them amply sufficient for all the beneficial purposes contemplat- into an acquiescence in that abuse. ed by it. But give it the most enlarged and liberal construction which has ever been contended for, and it will ret be incapable of accomplishing the purposes of its creation, unless its administration finds a support in the allsustaining power of public opinion. Every additional representative in this body adds one to the ties which bind the people to their Government, and its several parts to each other.

I know the constitution interposes a check, in the advising power of the Senate. But the most rigid exercise of that power cannot prevent the grossest favoritism in the dispensation of Executive patronage--a patronage which inakes the Chief Magistrate the centre of an influence exerting itself, with various effect, upon an army of more than fourteen thousand officers scattered over the face of our whole country.

But, sir, there is yet another advantage resulting from But suppose, sir, that some President should arise, who, a numerous representation here, of great and paramount under the authority which the constitution confers to "fill importance. A large popular representation in this body, vacancies which may happen during the recess of the SeI regard as an indispensable protection against the en- nate," should assume the power to create those vacancies croachments of Executive power. Sir, it is no visionary for the sole purpose of filling them. I fervently hope the enthusiasm which admonishes me of the existence of this time may be far, very far distant, when such a power shall danger. All history is full of instruction on this subject. be exercised. But it is not too much to suppose that, in Power in the hands of an individual, I care not whether the progress of national degeneracy, that time may come. he be an elected President, or an hereditary King, has Now, sir, with the assumption of such a power, where always been peculiarly liable to abuse, and always will be. would be the check to the influence which the vast amount From the ample powers which the constitution confers of Executive patronage confers upon your Chief Magison your Chief Magistrate, I select but a single one as an trate? It cannot be found in any power which the constiillustration of my remark. It is the power of appointment. tution directly confers upon this House; and in the case And permit me, sir, to glance, for a moment, at the ex- supposed, the power of the Senate is, in effect, annihilattent to which the administration of this Government ne- ed. Where, then, shall we look for it? In the power of cessarily involves the exercise of this power, and the vast the people, it will be readily answered. But is there no patronage which is thus directly and indirectly concen- way in which that power can be felt, but when it is exertrated in the hands of a single man. I am guided in my cised directly in the election of the President?--and none inquiries by the “Blue Book" of 1830, which contains in which it can be brought to bear more speedily upon

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Apportionment Bill.

[JAN. 31, 1832.

Executive abuses, than in that election? There is: this patronage of your Chief Magistrate is capable of directing House consists of the representatives of the people. They this all-powerful agent against every member of this body. are elected once in two years; while the President holds Let the administration of this Government arrive at the his office for twice that period. Give, then, to the peo- point of making the conductors of the public press the ple a numerous representation in this body; and, although objects of its special regard, for the purpose of rewarding there may be no specific corrective power vested in it by their partisan services, and binding them to its support, the constitution, there may yet be exercised a moral and there is not a member of this House who may not be power-a power inherent in a numerous assembly of re-made to feel its power! presentatives, coming directly from the midst of the peo- But how, I am asked, will this evil be diminished by inple, which no man, not utterly insensible to the force of public opinion, can long resist.

creasing the number of this body? Sir, can the power of conferring one hundred tempting appointments exert the But there is another aspect in which this evil is to be same degree of influence on a body of four hundred as on a regarded. It is the influence which the Chief Magistrate body of one hundred men? Does not the negative of this is capable of exerting, in various ways, upon this body, proposition approach as near to mathematical certainty, as either for the purpose of subduing its opposition to an un- can any political proposition? And, besides, there is somedue exercise of his patronage, or for the purpose of car- thing in the very magnitude of a numerous body of the rying his favorite measures. But how can this fearful people's representatives, which insensibly rebukes the prepower be brought to bear, successfully, upon this House? sumption that dares approach it with the seductions of pa I answer, by holding out to its members the allurements tronage, or the denunciations of power: while the nearer of Executive favor. I will not detain the House by going the representative is brought to his constituents, the more into an argument to prove this; but will content myself will he imbibe their spirit-a spirit which patronage canwith the production of an authority, which, sir, with your not seduce, nor power subdue. permission, I will read. It is that of the individual who is now Chief Magistrate of the United States.

The great agent of reform in Europe is physical force. But while abuses there are assailed by mobs, it is the peOn the 7th of November, 1825, General Jackson com- culiar glory of our institutions, that here they may be asmunicated to the Legislature of Tennessee his resignation sailed successfully at the ballot box. Let there be given of his seat in the Senate of the United States. In that to this remedy its highest possible effect. To do this, sir, communication, after alluding to a proposed amendment the body over which you preside should be made a cor to the constitution relative to the election of President rect barometer of public opinion. Where, let me ask, is and Vice President, he says: "I venture fully to accord there any other? The President is elected once in four with you in the contemplated change proposed to the con-years--the Senators in six. Here is the place where the stitution, and indeed would go further. With a view to slightest change in public opinion should be immediately sustain more effectually, in practice, the axiom which di- indicated; and here, if the people are true to themselves, vides the three great classes of power into independent it will be indicated with unerring certainty. constitutional checks, I would impose a provision render- To give, therefore, the greatest effect to the popular ing any member of Congress ineligible to office, under the will in this body, let the number of its members be inGeneral Government, during the term for which he was creased to the highest point consistent with practicable leelected, and for two years thereafter, except in cases of gislation; and let them be elected by districts, and on the judicial office. The effect of such a constitutional provi- same day, throughout the United States. Thus will this sion is obvious. By it, Congress would, in a considerable body be brought near to the people; become a just and degree, be free from that connexion with the Executive true representation of their interests and feelings; present Department, which, at present, gives strong ground of a strong barrier to the encroachments of Executive power, apprehension and jealousy on the part of the people. and answer the great ends of its original institution. Members, instead of being liable to be withdrawn from A word, sir, in reply to an objection which has been legislating on the great interests of the nation, through urged, and I shall have done. prospects of Executive patronage, would be more liberal- We are often told that there is too much debating in ly confided in by their constituents; while their vigilance this body, and that it will be increased with an increase would be less interrupted by party feelings and party ex- of the numbers. Why, sir, for what do we come here? citements. Calculations from intrigue or management To legislate upon the interests of a great nation. And would fail; nor would their deliberations, or their investi- what body ever legislated safely without deliberation, or gation of subjects, consume so much time. But if this deliberated profitably without discussion. Make this change in the constitution should not be obtained, and im- House more, or make it less numerous, and speeches will portant appointments continue to devolve on the represen- still be made, and the same time consumed by debate that tatives in Congress, it requires no depth of thought to be is now consumed. Sir, it must be so. We represent a convinced that corruption will become the order of the talking people. And why are they such? Because they day, and that, under the garb of conscientious sacrifices are a free people. We talk because we are their repreto establish precedents for the public good, evils of serious sentatives, sent here to discuss and deliberate upon subimportance to the freedom and prosperity of the republic jects which deeply concern them. And this deliberation may arise. It is through this channel that the people may and discussion accomplishes but half its purpose, if it is expect to be attacked in their constitutional sovereignty, not so conducted as to give to those who sent us here the and where tyranny may well be apprehended to spring up, reasons of the results to which our deliberations and disin some favorable emergency." cussions may bring us.

Sir, who will undertake to dispute this authority? Our legislation necessarily embraces a wide range of inIf it be true, then, that Executive patronage possesses quiry. The laws we enact are the people's laws, and we act the power of seducing the members of this body by direct on them; while, as their agents, we are directly responsioffers to them of the honors and emoluments of office, it ble to them for the administration of their Government. is equally true that it may be exerted upon them by the But how are they to understand our legislation, and hold appointment of the friends they may desire to serve. Who us to a just accountability for its correctness? I answer, can calculate the extent of the influence which the Presi- in the first place, by a perusal of the debates of this body. dent, through the thousands of offices directly or indi- They should possess the means of going along with us in rectly within his gift, may thus be able to command? our investigations, so that they may understandingly apBut there is another instrument which may be wielded prove or disapprove our decisions. In the next place, let with still greater efficacy. It is the press. Yes, sir, the the laws we pass, of a public nature, be published in

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[H. OF R.

every newspaper throughout the United States. The the committee who reported this bill, which, in the opipeople should know, or possess the means of knowing,nion of gentlemen, gives Tennessee such undue advanwhat their agents have done, as well as their reasons for tages? Sir, they come from five different States--Louisidoing it. And last, though not least, let the people have a ana, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New York, and Tennessee-the numerous representation in this body, to the end that the chairman happening to be from Tennessee. Do gentle. representatives may be brought into the nearest possible men think that the chairman had such influence with the intimacy with their constituents. They are the agents to committee as to induce them to report a bill merely to whom the people have committed the high trust of making favor Tennessee? I do not believe, sir, that the chairman laws for them. And if there is any agency on earth, in had any such influence; and I think the committee will which, more than in any other, it is necessary that the will deny that they were under any such. of the principal should be known, and, when known, Sir, my colleagues have again and again assured the obeyed, it is this. The intercourse of the representative House that they were not wedded to 48: that they felt with the people should, therefore, be unrestrained. He very indifferent as to the number which should be adoptshould freely mingle with them, not for the mere purpose ed. For my own part, Mr. Speaker, so far from being of courting their favor, and securing their votes, but for wedded to this number, I have invariably, when the questhe far higher and nobler, and more useful purpose of tion came up, voted in favor of all numbers which have imbibing their spirit-of entering into their feelings of been proposed under 48.

this all.

understanding their character--of appreciating their When the apportionment was first mooted, I am free to wants, and of comprehending their true interests. Nor is confess, sir, that my feelings were enlisted on the side of high numbers. The first consideration which gave my The character of the representative will thus become mind a different direction was not the great principle insensibly moulded into that of the honest, unsophisticated which now governs me. I am frank to confess, sir, that people whom he represents; while they, in turn, may de- I was actuated by a desire that our little sister, Rhode rive a corresponding benefit from his intelligence and Island, should not be shorn of any of her strength in this intimate acquaintance with the operations of their Govern- House. But, sir, the more I have looked into this subject, ment. Thus acting and reacting on each other, there the further the discussion of fundamental principles has will insensibly be produced that identity of feeling and been pushed, the more and more have I been inclined to purpose which can alone preserve in its purity the true the opinion that there is more danger in making this representative principle of our Government. House too small, than in making it too large. Ours is a Finally, by putting into the hands of the people, as far Government composed of different features. This House as practicable, the debates of this and the co-ordinate constitutes the republican feature. This House constibranch of the Government; by placing within the reach tutes the branch of the Government with which the people of them all the results of our legislation; and by a free are most familiar, and most intimately and vitally connectand familiar intercourse of the representatives with their ed. I grant, sir, that there is a point at which its numconstituents, the tone of the public mind will become bers must be limited; but in my humble opinion that point elevated, and the spirit of investigation aroused-a spirit, is not yet reached. Sir, I must stop; for I find myself insir, which forms the conservative principle of this Govern- voluntarily going into the general discussion, which I did ment, and is the life and soul and glory of our republican not intend to do, and which I will not do. I rose merely, institutions. as I before stated, to correct what I thought to be an erMr. Speaker, to me this question, independent of its roneous impression. I wished to show gentlemen that bearing upon the State I have the honor, in part, to repre- Tennessee sought no undue advantage over her sisters. sent, is one of great general importance, and I have, That, if fortune had thrown a seeming advantage in her therefore, thus long trespassed on your patience. In re- way, she was still disposed to be liberal; and even disposed gard to the extent to which this body may properly be to yield a portion of her good fortune, to the end that increased, I profess not to have any "golden number." power and burden might be more equally distributed. The objections I have urged against the ratio of repre- Sir, I repeat that I have, on every vote taken to strike out sentation proposed in the bill on your table, founded upon and fill with a less number than forty-eight, voted for it. its unequal and unjust operation, appeared to me unan-I felt that in doing so I was truly representing the feelings swerable. The ratio of 44,000, which I hope may be of Tennessee. The present motion being merely to substituted for it, while it does justice to my own State, strike out 48, without offering to insert any other number, and, I believe, to all the States more effectually than any I shall be compelled to vote against it. If the motion can other, will give a House of Representatives approximat-be so modified as to insert another number in lieu of 48, ing nearer to what I believe it may safely and usefully be, I will still vote as heretofore. I do not wish, Mr. Speaker, than the ratio contained in the bill. I hope, therefore, to dictate to this House the course they should pursue; that 48,000 may be stricken out. but of one thing I feel pretty certain, and that is, that

Mr. ARNOLD, of Tennessee, said he had not intended not much good will result from further discussion on this to say one word on this subject, nor did he then rise for subject. The question has been thoroughly and ably disthe purpose of discussing the general question, or of con- cussed. My friend from Vermont, who has just taken his troverting any of the principles which had been so forci- seat, has occupied the whole ground. As to his general bly urged upon the House by his friend from Vermont; views on the subject, I yield them my most decided apbut he rose for the purpose of correcting an impression probation. And, in conclusion, sir, I must do him the which seemed to have stimulated various gentlemen in justice to say that I have been much interested and gratifirunning tilts at Tennessee. The number 48, sir, happens ed with the expanded and statesmanlike views which he to be the number selected by the committee to fill the has expressed on the subject.

blank in the bill now under consideration. That number Mr. KERR, of Maryland, supported the motion to strike leaves Tennessee a very small fraction. Tennessee does out, since he preferred the number "44." He argued seem to be favored by the selection which the committee in favor of a numerous House, and against large electoral have made; I am willing to agree, sir, that she is actually districts, as naturally leading to the improper predomifavored by this selection. But I will not agree that Tennes-nance of a caucus. Mr. K. contended that in a small see has sought this favor, or that she has any desire to House there would be quite as much speaking, greater adhere to it for the purpose of disparaging her sisters. rivalship, and more personality.

No, sir; I assure gentlemen that Tennessee has no such Mr. LAMAR demanded the yeas and nays on the quesfeelings. Tennessee is no bucksteress. Whence came❘tion of striking out, and they were ordered by the House.

VOL. VIII.-107