The King's Message respecting Advances to the Emperor of Germany, &c.] Feb. 13. Mr. Pitt presented the following Message from his Majesty: "GEORGE R. nimous opinion of those who have appeared in evidence before them, would lead to a very considerable saving of wheat flour. The evidence of the bakers who have been examined before your Committee, cannot fail to convince the House, that in families where bread which has been baked for some hours is used, the consumption is far less considerable than in those where it is the custom to eat it new. They differ in the proportion of this saving: some have stated it as amounting to onethird, some as amounting to one-fifth, and others only to one-eighth; but when it is considered that one-half of the bread in Lon don is consumed the day on which it is baked, there can be no doubt that a great saving would ensue (perhaps one-tenth or twelfth part of the whole consumption in London), if the bakers were prohibited from selling it, until twenty-four hours after it was baked. Your Committee are strongly induced to recommend this measure, from the consideration that a very respectable physician has given it as his decided opinion, that new bread is far less wholesome than that which has been baked a certain number of hours: and they think it important to add, that, in the opinion of the bakers in the metropolis, no material inconvenience or detriment to their trade would arise from the adopting this regulation. Your Committee have heard, with very great concern, that from the mistaken application of the charity of individuals, in some parts of the country, flour and bread have been delivered to the poor at a reduced price; a practice which may contribute very considerably to increase the inconveniencies arising from the deficiency of the last crop. And they recommend that all charity and parochial relief should be given, as far as is practicable, in any other articles except bread, flour, and money, and that the part of it which is necessary for the sustenance of the poor, should be distributed in soups, rice, potatoes, or other substitutes. Your Commit tee are of opinion, that if this regulation was generally adopted, it would not only, in a very great degree, contribute to economize at this time the consumption of flour, but that it might have the effect of gradually introducing into use, a more wholesome and nutritious species of food than that to which the poor are at present accustomed. Your Committee think it important to state before they conclude, that government, in conformity to the declaration of the chancellor of the exchequer in the last session of parliament, have abstained from all interference in the purchases of corn in the foreign markets; and as they conceive the speculations of individuals are more likely to produce an adequate supply of foreign wheat at the present crisis, than any other measures that could be adopted, the policy of government in this respect meets with the decided approbation of your Committee, "His Majesty is at present employed in concerting such engagements with the emperor of Germany, the elector of Bavaria, and other powers of the empire, as may strengthen the efforts of his imperial majesty, and materially conduce to the advantage of the common cause in the Majesty will give directions that these encourse of the ensuing campaign; and his gagements, as soon as they shall have been completed and ratified, shall be laid before the House: But, in order to ensure the benefit of this co-operation at an early period, his Majesty is desirous of authorising his minister to make provisionally such advances as may be necessary, in the first instance, for this purpose; and his Majesty recommends it to the House to enable him to make such provision accordingly. G. R." A similar Message was presented to the Lords by lord Grenville. Debate in the Lords on the King's Message respecting Advances to the Emperor of Germany, &c.] Feb. 14. The order of the day being read, for taking the King's Message into consideration, In Lord Grenville said, he conceived after theuniform votes of the House, on the subject of prosecuting the war with vigour, that it would be an idle waste of time were he to enter into detail on the matter under consideration. It had been generally admitted by parliament, that it was the truest policy of Great Britain to procure the assistance of the forces of continental states, by subsidizing their sovereigns; and upon that received principle it was, that his majesty had negotiated with the German princes, for a certain number of military forces for the ensuing campaign. deed, these treaties were in such forwardness, that although he could not officially state that they were concluded, he could take upon himself to declare to their lordships, that by this time the principal of them were finally settled, and upon terms highly advantageous to the country. As the sending the treaties over here, and the return of them previous to their final ratification, unavoidably took up much time, his majesty's ministers had thought it their duty to apply to parliament, to authorize them to make such advances pro visionally to our German allies as the conditions of the respective treaties might require. His lordship then moved, "That an humble Address be presented to his majesty, to return to his majesty, the thanks of this House for his most gracious message; that impressed as we are with the necessity of the vigorous prosecution of the war, we assure his majesty that we will readily concur in enabling him to make such advances as may be necessary with a view to the engagements which his majesty is now negotiating for the advantage of the common cause, in the course of the ensuing campaign." coalition, and called upon to put our trust in this particular part of it, he begged the House to pause before they entangled themselves in new engagements, before they voted away their money, and pledged themselves to an undertaking so difficult in its accomplishment, so ruinous in its failure. Let them examine the propriety of continuing the war by the desirableness of the object, the effect of success towards the attainment of that object, the conse quences of failure, and the probability of success. He would first suppose the ar mies of our allies triumphant every where. Were the ministers certain that these triumphs would tend to restore royalty Lord Holland said, that if the purport of the present measure was merely to ex-in France, or even annihilate the power change Russian for German mercenaries, to that he not only should have no objection, but should even think we gained by the exchange. In the first place, we should gain by knowing that those we employed rendered the horrors of war less heart-breaking, less disgusting than those we intended to employ. We should also gain in point of soldiers; for he was happy to say that the troops of Austria, Prussia, France, and England, were greatly their superiors in all the qualifications necessary to form a powerful army. But it was not a mere exchange of troops: we were to subsidize German troops instead of Russians: but were German troops ready to contend for the same objects? Did the cabinet of Vienna cordially approve of all the principles laid down in our answer to Buonaparte? Did the emperor of Germany really think that the surest means of frestoring peace would be the restoration of the Bourbons? Did he not rather imagine that the sacrifice of the territories of his fellow hireling, the elector of Bavaria, to his ambitious projects, would be a shorter measure? At the same time, the statesmen of Vienna had too much wisdom to limit the possibility of peace to the success of their favourite projects. Like our prudent ministers, they would allow that other events might possibly lead to that desirable end: a slice of Switzerland perhaps; a great portion of Italy, or any other cession of territory, might be among the events, and the imperial court did not, he would venture to say, lay claim to prescribe exactly what sacrifices on the part of France would gratify her ambition, and restore the blessings of peace. She had already made one peace with the republic, and was, no doubt, ready to make another. With this view of the and influence of that country? Would they, in case of success, answer for the conduct of Austria? He would suppose a sincere conversion in the cabinet of Vienna, and their arms attended with the greatest success. He would suppose them in possession of Switzerland, entering on the French territories, fighting in Alsace and Lorraine: well, let us at least examine, if with such extraordinary success and good faith, our point would be gained. He conjured the House to reflect on this, and to dismiss, for one moment, that childish feeling, too prevalent in this country, that foreign states and princes were moral or immoral, politic or impolitic, in exact proportion as they furthered or thwarted the interests of Great Britain. Let the House reflect that the king of Prussia was not bound by any oath of allegiance, to promote our designs, or render his power subservient to British objects; but that he was bound by that duty which all sovereigns owed to their situation, to se cure the interests of his subjects, and the power and influence of his state; and then he would ask any man, at all candid or impartial, whether, if he were minister to his Prussian majesty, he could, con sistently with his duty, advise that prince to sit tamely by and see the hereditary rival of his house, the power most formi dable to his own, from its situation and its general politics, crush and dismember the country of France, which could alone operate as a check to that rival; which could alone protect him from the effects of that powerful house, directed by ancient animosity to the object of annihilat ing his influence, and destroying his power in Germany and in Europe? Why then, what would be the consequence even of success. It would be (unless the The House divided: Contents, 28; Not-contents, 3. Debate in the Commons on the King's Message respecting Advances to the Emperor of Germany, &c.] Feb. 17. The House having resolved itself into a Committee of Supply, to which the King's Message was referred, councils of Prussia were suddenly to become at once base and stupid) the immediate interference of that power to rescue France from our designs, and to defeat the accomplishment of that object to which we were sacrificing so much.-He would now look to the other side of the picture he would suppose us and our allies beaten-he would suppose the armies of Buonaparté triumphant. What would Mr. Pitt rose and said:-The motion then be the resource of ministers? He which I shall submit to the committee, is knew enough of their character, not to founded upon a principle which has been know that they would then have recourse often recognized in this House, that we to negotiation, to what Mr. Burke happily are to proceed in a vigorous prosecution termed their "mendicant diplomacy," of the war; a measure which we feel to be When well beaten and defeated in all their necessary to the safety, honour, and hapdesigns, they would pretend to have had ex- piness of the country. Those who are of perience of Buonaparte's government, and opinion that government acted wisely in then see other possible and speedier means declining negotiation at this period with of peace than the restoration of the Bour- the enemy, will not be backward in conbons. They would be as mean and crouch-senting to continue, or, if necessary, to ing in their overtures of peace to Buonaparté, as they had been insolent in their answers to his overtures lately. But could they expect, they who had treated him as the most insolent and violent of mankind, that he would be actuated with such equity and moderation as to grant to their supplications, when defeated, that peace which they had refused to him with disdain when they imagined him in adversity? -The noble lord then proceeded to state the inconveniences of subsidies, and the little faith that was to be placed in the promises of courts. We had subsidized almost every German prince, and almost every German prince had deceived and betrayed us; but he must confess that when he reflected on the amount, the consequences, and the little advantage this country had hitherto derived from subsidies, he had hoped that a subsidy was one of the few measures to which parliament would not, without much deliberation consent. For his part, he could not see without regret and alarm, large sums of money sent out of the kingdom, merely to purchase for ourselves treachery and disappointment, and to the house of Austria additional territory and aggrandizement. He conjured the House, therefore, since they had that night learnt that reliance upon that cabinet was to be one of their chief hopes of success, to reflect again, and not to engage in an undertaking so desperate in its appearance, in which success itself seemed only to lead to new wars, new expenses, and new embarrassments, and in which failure, which seemed but too probable, was little short of disgrace and ruin. augment the force that may be deemed 500,000l. should be advanced by way of commencement. The object of it is to secure the co-operation of such a force as is likely to be superior to any force the French can bring to the frontier. The total amount of the advances, will probably be two millions and a half. I shall now move, "That a sum not exceeding 500,000l. be granted to his majesty, to enable his majesty to make such advances as may be necessary for the purpose of ensuring, at an early period, the benefit of a vigorous co-operation against France, in consequence of the engagements which his majesty is concerting with the emperor of Germany, the elector of Bavaria, and the other powers of the empire." Mr. Nicholls said, that he wished, before he could agree to send such a sum of money out of the kingdom, to ascertain what quantity of corn would be necessary for the supply of the wants of this country. The last crop had been deficient a full fourth. This would leave two millions of quarters of wheat to be purchased to supply the deficiency. Could this quantity be procured from the Baltic. What would be the expense at which this grain could be purchased? He himself thought that 12,000,000l. was not over-rating the expense. He hoped the committee would pause before they consented to adopt a measure which might interfere with the interests and prevent the relief of the poor of this country, or, if prosecuted, affect our commercial credit. Mr. Bouverie said, that the overture for negotiation had, in his opinion, been treated insolently. Had it appeared, that every measure had been taken to secure an honourable peace, then if it had failed, there was scarcely a man in the country who would not have considered the prose cution of the war as a common cause, and who would not have coincided with cheerfulness in every exertion for its success. He considered it, however, ridiculous to assert, that any scarcity of corn can exist in this country to make the nation hesitate as to the prosecution of a great national object. Indeed, in the present case, he was convinced that there was plenty of corn in the country to supply its inhabitants till next harvest. Mr. Tierney said:-It has been observed, that gentlemen have committed themselves, by voting for the prosecution of the war, to vote for the supplies necessary to carry it on: but surely a change of circumstances may produce a change of opinion, and gentlemen who voted for prosecuting the war, while they were con fidently told that the differences between the two imperial courts were at an end; may now think that a change has taken place sufficient to authorize their change of opinion, when they hear what amounts to an official avowal of the defection of the emperor of Russia. I know it will be said, that that power has not deserted from the object of the war; that her troops are only to be withdrawn from active operation on the continent of Europe; and that she still retains all her desire of promoting the real object of the war. But did this power ever furnish a man without being paid for him? Or will the emperor of Russia now co-operate with us, except on the old terms, that we shall pay his troops, feed them, clothe them, and send them home again, when we have done with them, each with a bounty money in his pocket, under the name of two months additional pay? But let us enquire how far there can be any real co-operation between us and the emperor of Germany. His object, which he has avowed to all Europe, is totally distinct from any view to the restoration of the Bourbons and of the French monarchy. Has he not, by his whole conduct, proved that it is his only object to increase his power, to make territorial acquisitions, and to recover the countries which he has lost? Had the right hon. gentleman told the House this day, that the emperor of Germany had got over his difficulties, and had now avowed a common cause with this country and Russia, there would have been some plausibility, that the object for which a subsidy would be granted might be at tained. But the case is widely different: we are asked to subsidize a power which is at war indeed against the same nation with whom we are at war, but who is at war for a very different object. I believe the object of ministers is the restoration of monarchy in France, notwithstanding the ifs and buts, and the diplomatic special pleading, which they have always introduced when this subject is brought under consideration. For the promotion of this object, I never will consent to vote one shilling of the public money. I may wish the restoration of some better order in France, but the circumstances of this country may be such that I cannot be authorized to vote one farthing to promote it. An hon. gentleman has been blamed for introducing the scarcity of ranted in voting, that the money or the corn: but, if there is one subject more blood of this country should be wasted in connected than another with this discus- a contest to which I see no end, and for sion, it is this. It surely is not improper a purpose totally undefined. Is the deto inquire whether it is expedient to send struction of Jacobin principles the object money from this country to supply the which ministers have in view? Let us wants of others, while we have so great a suppose that this is the object; do they necessity to turn all our means to the intend to fight against it till they extinsupply of our own. The war has now guish its last embers? What is this Jacontinued seven years. During the cobin spirit? Let them define it, that we greater part of that time it has been de- may know against what we fight. But it fended on the principles that it was "just is something indescribable; a phantom and necessary," and 200 millions have which is only now known by the designabeen expended in defence of these tion which has been given it. They must words. Of late, however, we have know that Jacobinism is now in France heard nothing of the justice and necessity much diminished in its power and influof the war, and the words just and ne- ence. The late events which have taken cessary have died a natural death. In- place in that country have almost annideed, now the war can neither be said to hilated it, or have at least deprived it of be just nor necessary. It is not just, all that ever rendered it attractive. The because its object is to restore monarchy principles of Jacobinism so much deprein France: it is not necessary, because cated always tended to some species of we have refused to negotiate when an op-liberty-to vesting the power in the hands portunity was in our power. The principle of the people. This liberty is now totally of the present proposition now demands abolished, and with it Jacobinism must from me a few words of observation. expire. But if the same measures are This principle is shortly this: you have pursued which gave it birth and energy, voted for the continuance and prosecution it may revive. But in truth I do not of the war, and if you act consistently, think that this can be the real object of you will vote for this subsidy of 500,000l. the war. This object must either be being granted. But it will not end here: something hidden in the minds of minishaving once voted this sum, you will be ters, which they are afraid to publish, or asked to vote much larger subsidies. I something which they themselves have cannot believe that any of this 500.000l. not ascertained. It may be the restorais intended for the emperor. He will not tion of the house of Bourbon; but I would conform to the views of the right hon. wish the right hon. gentleman in one sengentleman, and would not, I dare say, tence to state what this object is. I am peraccept a subsidy on the principle of con- suaded he cannot; and that he calls us to forming to them. But is not the war as prosecute a war, and to lavish our treasure much the business of the emperor of Ger- and blood in its support, when no one plain many, and of the states of the empire, as satisfactory and intelligible reason can be of this country? I shall be told, perhaps, given for its continuance. that they have abundance of zeal, but little money. This was the statement at the beginning of the war; and when subsidies were then granted by this country, similar arguments were used. Then the emperor got four or five millions. But at a subsequent period, when he got no supplies from this country, did it appear that his resources were smaller, or his exertions less energetic? How, then, can it now be argued, that without a subsidy from us he will be unable to call the men into the field? If ministers had negotiated sincerely, when overtures were made to them, it is possible, that we might have had a secure, an honourable, and a lasting peace; and if this chance has been wantonly renounced, then I am not war[VOL. XXXIV.] Mr. Pitt said:-The hon. gentleman defies me to state, in one sentence, what is the object of the war. In one word, I tell him that it is security ;-security against a danger, the greatest that ever threatened the world-security against a danger which never existed in any past period of society. This country alone, of all the nations of Europe, presented barriers the best fitted to resist its progress. We alone recognized the necessity of open war, as well with the principles, as the practice of the French revolution. We saw that it was to be resisted no less by arms abroad, than by precaution at home; that we were to look for protection no less to the courage of our forces than to the wisdom of our councils; no less to [42] |