Page images
PDF
EPUB

objected this holds not confirmation unlawful; , authority in this land." These are not sulficient, but he and his party are vexed that the use unless it were added, nor ought to have any. thereof is not in their own hands, for every His Majesty. Habemus jure, quod habemus, pastor to contirm his own parish; for then it and therefore in as much as it is said he hath would be accounted an Apostolical institution, not, it is plain enough that he ought not to if Dr. Reynolds were pleased but to speak his have. thoughts therein.

Here passed some pleasant discourse betwist Dr. Reyn. Indeed seeing some diocese of a the king and lords about puritans, till returning bishop bath therein six hundred Parishes, it is to seriousness : There began the a thing very inconvenient to permit Confirma Bp. of Lond. May it please your majesty tion to the bishop alone ; and I suppose it iin to remember the Speech of the French ambospossible that he can take due examination of sador, monsieur Regnee, upon the view of our them all which come to be confirmed.

solemn service and ceremony, viz. That if the Bp. of Lond. To the matter of f ct, I an- Reformed Churches in France had kept the swer, that bishops in their Visitations appoint same order, there would have been thousands either their chaplains, or some other ministers, of Protestants more than there are. to examine them which are to be confirmed, Dr. Keyn. It were well if this proposition and lightly confirm none but by the testimony might be added to the Book of Articles. The of the parsons and curates, where the children intention of the minister is not of the essence are bred and brought up.-To the Opinion I of the sacrament,' the rather, because some in answer, that none of all the Fathers ever ad- England have preached it to be essential; and i mitted any to confirm bat bishops alone. Yea, here again I could desire that the vine orthoeven St. Jerome himself (otherwise no friend to doxal Assertions concluded at Lambeth, may bishops) confesseth the execution thercut was be generally received, restrained to bishops only.

His Maj. I utterly dislike the first part of Bp. of Winch. Dr. Reynolds, I would fain your motion, thinking it unfit to thrust isto the have you, with all your learning, sbew wherever Book of Articles every position negative, which Confirmation was used in ancient times by any would swell the book into a volume as big as other bishops; These used it partly to examine the Bible, and confound the reader. Thus children, and after examination by imposition one M. Craig in Scotland with, his, I renounce of bands (the Jewish ceremony of blessing) to and abhor his multiplied detestations and abrebless and pray over them; and partly to try nuntiations, so amazed sinple people, that not whether they had been baptised in the right able to conceive all their things, they fell back form or no. For in former ages some baptised to popery, or remained in their former igno(as they ought) in the name of the Fatber, Son, rance. If bound to this form, the confession of aud Holy Ghost. Some (as the Arians) in the my faith must be in my table-book, not in my name of the Father as the greater, and the Son head.-Because you speak of Intention, I will as the less. Some in the name of the Father by apply it thus. If you come hither with a good the Son, in the Holy Ghost. Some not in the intention to be informed, the whole work will name of the Trinity, but only in the Death of sort to the better effect: Buc if your intention Christ. Whereupon Catholic bishops were con be to go as you came, whatsoever shall be said, strained to examine them who were baptised in it will prove the intention is very material and remolis, concerning their Baptism, if right to essential to the end of this present action.--As confirm them, if amiss to instruct them. for the nine Assertions you speak of, I cannot

His Majesty. I dissent from the judgment suddenly answer, not knowing what those Proof St. Jerome in his assertion, that bishops are positions of Lambeth be. not of divine ordination.

Bp. of Lond. May it please your majesty, Bp. of Lond. Unless I could prove my Or- this was the occasion of them, by reason of dination lawful out of the Scriptures, I would some controversies arising in Cambridge about not be a bishop four hours longer.

certain points of divinity, my lord's grace asHis Majesty. I approve the calling and use sembled some divines of special note to set of bishops in the Church, and it is my aphorisan, down their Opinions, which they drew into • No Bishop, No King; nor intend I to také nine Assertions, and so sent them to the Unis Confirmation from the bishops, which they have versity for the appeasing of those quarrels. so long enjoyed. Seeing as great reason that His Mai. When such questions arise none should confirm, as that none should amongst scholars, the quietest proceedings were preach without the bishop's license. But let it to determine them in the University, and not be referred, whether the word Exainination to stuff the Book of Articles, with all Concluought not to be added to the rubrick in the title sions theological.-Secondly, the better course of Confirmation in the Communion-book. And would be to punish the broachers of false doc. now Dr. Reynolds you may proceed.

trine, than to multiply Articles, which, if never Dr. Reyn. I protest I meant not to gall any so many, cannot prevent the contrary opinions man, though I perceive some look personal ex of men till they be heard. ceptions at my words, and desire the imputa Dean of Pauls. May it please your majesty, tion of schism may not be charged upon me. I am nearly concerned in this matter, by reaTo proceed on the 37th Article, wherein are son of a Controversy betwixt me and some these words, “ The Bishop of Rome hath no other in Cambridge, upon a Proposition, which

I there delivered, namely, that whosoever followed, there would be no end of translating. (though before justified) did commit any griev His Maj. I profess I could never yet see a ous sin, as adultery, murder, &c. do become Bible well translated in English; but I think, ipso facto, subject io God's wrath, and guilty that of all, that of Geneva is the worst. I wish of damnation, quoad præsentun statum, until some special pains were taken for an uniforın they repent. Yet, so that those who are justi- translation ; which should be done by the best fied according to the purpose of God's Election learned in both Universities, then reviewed by (though they might fall into grievous sin, and the bishops, presented to the privy councii, thereby into the present estate of damnation) lastly ratified by royal authority, io be read in yet never totally nor finally from Justification the whole church, and no other. but were in time renewed by God's spirit unto Bp. of Lond. But it is fit that no marginal a lively faith and repentance. Against this notes should be added thereunto. doctrine some did oppose, teaching that per His Maj. That caveat is well put in, for in sons once truly justified, though falling into the Geneva translation, some notes are partial, grievous sins, remained still in the state of Jus- untrue, seditious, and savouring of traitorous tification, before they actually repented of these conceits : As, ulier from Éxodus i. 19. Disosins; yea, and though they never repented of bedience to kings is allowed in a marginal note. them through forgetfulness or sudden death, And 2 Chron. xv. 16, king Asa taxed in the they nevertheless vere justified and saved. note for only deposing his mother for idolatry,

His Maj. I dislike this doctrine, there be and not killing her. To conclude this point, ing a necessity of conjoining repentance and let errors, in matters of faith, be amended, and holiness of lite with true faith, and that is hy indifferent things be interpreted, and a gloss pocrisy, and not justifying faith, which is sever- added unto them. For as Bartolus de liegno ed from them. For although Predestination saith, that a king with some weakness, is better and Election depend not on any qualities, ac than still a change; so rather a Church with tions, or works of man which are mutable, but some faults, than an innovation. And surely, on God's eternal Decree : yet such is the ne. if these were the greatest matters that grieved cessity of Repentance after known sins com- you, I need not have been troubled with such mitted, that without it no Reconciliation with importunate complaints. God, or Remission of Sins.

Dr. Reyn. May it please your majesty, Dr. Reyn. The Catechism in the Common

that unlawful and seditious books be suppressPrayer-Book is too brief, and that hy Mr.ed, such as Ficlerus, a Papist, De Jure MagisNowel (late dean of Pauls) too long for novices tratus in Subditos, applied against the late to learn by heart. I request therefore that one queen for the Pope. uniform Catechism may be made, and none Bp. of Lond. There is no such licentious other generally received.

divulging of those books, and none have liberHis Maj. I think the doctor's request very ty, by authority, to buy them, except such as reasonable, yet so, that the Catechism may be Dr. Reynolds, who was supposed would conmade in the fewest and plainest affirinative fute them. And, if such books come into the terms that may be, not like the many ignorant realm by secret convevances, perfect notice Catechisins in Scotland, set out by every one

cannot be had of their importation. Besides, who was' the Son of a good man, insomuch Ficlerus was a great disciplinarian, whereby it that what was Catechism-doctrine in one con appears what advantage that sort gave unto gregation, was scarcely received as orthodox in the Papists, who, mutatis personis, apply their another; and herein I would have two rules own arguments against princes of their relia observed : First, That curious and deep ques- gion, though for my part I detest both the autions be avoided in the fundamental instruc- thor and applier alike. tion of a people, secondly, That there should The Ld. Cecil. Indeed the unlimited liberty not be so general a departure from the papists, of dispersing Popish and seditious pamphlets that every thing should he accounted an error in Pauls Church-yard, and both the Universiwherein we agree with them.

ties, hath done much mischief; but especially Dr. Reyn. Great is the profanation of the one called Speculum Tragicum. Sabbath day, and contempt of your majesty's His Asaj. That is a dangerous book indeed. Proclamation, which I earnestly desire may be L. H. Houard. Both for matter and intenreformed.

tion, This motion found an unanimous consent. L. Chan. Of such Books, some are Latin,

Dr. Reyn. May your inajesty be pleased some are English, but the last dispersed do most that the Bible be new translated, such as are

harm. extant not answering the original, and he in Secret. Cecil. But my lord of London (and stanced in three particulars.

no man else) bath done what he could to supGal. iv. 25.- In the original, ousonsi; ill-trans- press them.

lated, Bordereth.-Ps. cv. 28. Orig. They His Maj. Dr. Reynolds, you are a better were not disobedient; ill-trans., They were college-man than a states-man, if meaning to not obedient.-Ps. cvi. 30. Orig. Phine- tax the bishop of London for suffering those has executed judgment; ill-trans., Phi- books, between the Secular Priests and Jesuits, nehas prayed.

to be published, which he did by warrant from Bp. of Lond. If every man's humouc might be the council, to nourish a schism betwixt ebem.

LA Cecil. Such books were tolerated, be-, care that way; but a doublet is necessary in cause by them the title of Spain was confuted. cold weather.

Id, I'reasurer. And because therein it ap Ld. Chin. I dislile not the liberty of our pears, by the testimony of the priests them- church, in granting to one man two benefices, selves, that no Papists are put to death for but speak out of mine oun purpose and pracconscience only, but for treason.

tice, grounded on the aforesaid reason. Dr. Reyn. Indeed I meant not such books Bp. of Lund. My last motion is, that Pulas were printed in England, but only such as pits may not be made Pasquils, wherein every came from beyond the seas. And now to pro- i discontented fellow may traduce his superiors. ceed to the second general point, concerning His Maj. I accept what you offer, for the the planting of learned ministers, I desire they Pulpit is no place of personal reproof, let them be in every parish.

complain to me, it injured. His Alaj. I have consulted with my bishops' Bp. of Lond. If your majesty shall leave about it, whoin I have found willing and ready yourself open to admit of all complaints, your herei: but, as snbita evacuatio is periculosa'; highness shall never be quiet, nor your underso subita mutatio: It cannot presently be per- officers regarded, whom every delinquent, when formed, the Universities not affording them. censured, will threaten to complain of. And yet they afford more learned men, than the His Maj. I mean they shall complain to realın doch maintenance, which must be first me by degrees, first to the Ordinary, from him provided. In the mean time, ignorant minis to the Archbishop, from him to the lords of ters, if young, are to be removed, if there be the council; and, if in all these no remedy be no hope of amendment; if old, their death found, then to myself

. must be expected, because Jerusalem cannot Dr. Reyn. I come now to Subscription, as be built up in a day.

a great impeachment to a learned ministry, Bp. of IVinch. Lay patrons much cause the and therefore intreat it may not be exacted as insuiticiency of the clergy, presenting mean heretofore: for which many good men are kept clerks to their cures (the law admitting of such out, though otherwise willing to subscribe to sutficiency) and, if the bishop refuserh them, the Statutes of the Realm, Articles of Relipresently a quare impedit is sent out against gion, and the King's Supremacy. The reason him.

of their backwardness to subscribe, is, because Bp. of Lond. Because this I see is a time the Common-prayer enjoineth the Apocrypha of moving Petitions, inay I humbly present two books to be read in the church, although some or three to your majesty: First, That there chapters therein contain manisest errours remay be amongst us a praying ministry, it being pugnant to Scripture. For instance, Ecclus. now come to pass, that men think it is the xlvii. 10. Elias in person is said to come before only duty of ministers to spend their time in Christ, contrary to what is in the New Testathe pulpii. I confess, in a Church newly to be ment, Mat. xi. 14. Luke i. 17. of Elias in replanted, preaching is most necessary, not so in senıblance, that is, John the Baptist. one long established, that prayer should be Bp. of Lond. Most of the objections against neglected.

those books, are the old cavils of the Jews, His Maj. I like your motion exceeding well, renewed by S. Jerome (who first called them and dislike the hypocrisy of our time, wbo Apocriphn) which opinion, upon Rutinus bis place all their religion in the ear, whilst challenge, he, atier a sort, disclaimed. prayer (so requisite and acceptable, if duly Bp. of Winch. Indeed S. Jerome saith, Caperformed) is accounted and used as the least nonici sunt ad informundos mores non ad conpart of religion.

firmandam fidem. Bp. of Lond. My second motion is, that His Maj. To take an even order betwixt until learned men may be planted in every con- both, I would not have all canonical books read gregation, godly homilies may be read therein. in the church, nor any chapter out of the Apo

His Maj. 'I approve your motion, especially crypha, wherein any error is contained; wherewhere the living is not sufficient for the main fore let Dr. Reynolds note those chapters in tenance of a learned preacher. Also, where the Apocrypha books, wherein those offences there be multitudes of sermons, there I would are, and bring them to the abp. of Canterbury have homilies read divers tipies. [llere che against Wednesday next; and now Doctor, proking sked the assent of the plaintiffs, and they cecd. confessed it.]

Dr. Reyn. The next scruple against SubA preaching ministry is best, but where it scription, is, because it is twice set down in the may not be had, godly prayers and exhorta- Common-prayer-book, Jesus said to his discitions do much good.

ples, when by the text in the original, it is Ld. Chan. Livings rather want learned plain, that he spoke to the Pharisees. men, than learned men livings; many in the His Maj. Let the word Disciples be omitUniversities pining for want of places. I wish ted, and the words, Jesus said, be printed in a therefore some may have single coats (one living) difterent letter. before others have doublets (pluralities). And Mr. Kneustub. I take exceptions at the this method I bave observed in bestowing the Cross in Baptism, whereat the weak brethren kiny's benefices.

are offended, contrary to the counsel of the Bp. of Lond. I commend your honourable apostle, Romans xis. 2 Corinth. väi. VOL. II.

His Inj. Distingue tempora, & concorda- ; one Religion, in substance, and in ceremony. bunt Scriptura, great the diference betwixt ever speak more to that point, low far you those tiines and ours. Then, a Church not are bound to obey. fully settled; now, ours long established. Ilow Dr. Rryn. Would that the Cross, being long will such brethren be weak? Are not superstitiously abused iu Popery, were alranforty-five years sutricient for them to grow doned, as the Brazen Serpent was stuned to strong in ? Besides, who pretends this weak- powder by llezekias, because abuscd 10 wvianess? We require not Subscriptions of laicks iry. and ideots, but of preachers and ministers, who His 11aj. In as much as the Cross was are not still (I trow) to be fed with wiik, being abused to superstition in time or Popery, it enabled to feed others. Some of then are doth plainly imply that it was weli used be tire. strong enough, if not head-strong; conceiving I detest ieir courses, u ho peremptorily disalthemselves able enough to teach him who last low of all things, which liave been abused in spake for thein, and all the bishops in the land. | Popery, and know not how to answer the ob

Ur. K'next. It is questionable whether jections of the Papists, ritsen they charge us the Church hath power to institute an outwaru with novelties, but by telling them, we retain significant sigo.

the primitive use of things, and only forsake Bp. of Lond. The Cross in Baptism is not their novel corruptious. Secondly, no resem, used otherwise than a ceremony,

blance betwist the Brazen Serpent, a material Bp. of Ilinch. kneeling, lifting up of the risible thing, and the sign of the Cross, made hauds, knocking of the brtast, are signiticunt in the air. Thirdly, Papists (as I ain intorn.ed) ceremonies, and these may lutully be used. did ever ascribe any spiritual Grace to the

D. of the Chap. The Rabbins write, That Cross in Baptism. Lastly, material Crosses, to the Jews added both signs and words at the in- which people fell down in time of Popery (as stitution of the Passover, viz. when they eat the idolatrous Jews to the Brazen Scrpeni) are sour herbs, they said, “Take and eat these in already demolishel, as you desire. remembrance,' &c. When they drank wine, Mir. Kneust. I take exception at the wearthey said, “ Drink this in remeinbrance,' &c. ing of the Surplice, a kind of garment used by Upon which addition, and tradition, our Saviour the priests of İsis. instituted the Sacrainent of his last Supper, His liej. I did not think, till of late, it had thereby approving, a Church may institute and been borrowed froin the Heathen, because retain a sign sigurticant.

commonly called a rag of Popery. Secing now His Maj. I am exceedingly well satisfied we border not upon heathens, neither are any in this point, but would be acquainted about of them conversant with, or commorant amongst the antiquity of the use of the Cross.

us, thereby to be confirmed in Paganism; I Dr. Reyn. It halb been used ever since the no reason Lut for comeliness-sake, it may be Apostles time; but the question is, how ancient continued. the use thercof hath been in Baptism.

Dr. Reyn. I take exception at these words D. of Il'estin. It appears out of Tertullian, in the Marriage, with my body I chee worCyprian, and Origen, that it was used in im- ship.! mortali lutucro.

His Ilaj. I was made believe, the plırase Bp. of ll'inch. In Constantine's time it was imported no less than divine adoration, but find used in Baptism.

it an usual English terin, as when we say, ' a His Maj. If so, I sce no reason but that gentleman oi worship,' and it agreeth with the we may continue it.

Scriptures, 'giriig honour to the wife.' As for Mr. Krcust. Put the case the Church bath you, Dr. Reynolds, many men speak of Robin power to add signiticant signs, it may not adod ilood, who never shot in his bow. (This the them where Christ hath already ordained them, king spake smiling.) If you had a good wife which is as derogatory to Chiist's institution, yourself, you would think all worship and loas if one should add to the great seal of Eng- nour you could do her, were well bestowed on laod.

her. His Muj. The case is not alike, seeing the D. of Surum. Some take exception at the Sacrament is fully finished, before any mencion Ring in Viarriage. of the Cross is made therein.

Dr. Riyn. I approve it well enough. Mr. Knecos!. If the Church hath such a His Jinj. I was married with a Ring, and power, the greatest scruple is, how far the or- think others scarce wcil married without it. dinance of the Church bindeth, without im Dr. Reyn. Some tike exceptions at the peaching Christian literiv.

Churching of Women, by the name of Parifi-, His laj. I will not argue that point with cation. you, but answer is kings in parliament, L Roy His Mej. I alow it very well, women bes'eziseru ; This is like 81r. John Black, a heard- ing loath of themselves to come to church, I less boy, who told me, the last Conterence in like this, or any other occasion to draw them Scotland, (Dec. 1602,) that he would hold on thither. formity with his majesty in matters of Doctrine; Dr. L.c»9. My last exception is against but every m: for Ceremonies is to be let commiting Lcc.esiastical Censures to lay-chanto bis own liberty. But I will have none of cellors, the railer, because it was ordered, chat, I will have one Doctrine, one Discipline, anno 1571, that lay-chancellors, in matters of

see

[ocr errors]
[ocr errors]

Correcti mn, and anno 1589, in matters of In- f over, with silence, my being Supreme Governor
stance, sond not excommunicate any, but be in causes ecclesiastical. Well, doctor, bave you
done, uniy by then who had power of the any thing else to say ?
Kers, though the contrary is comiuonly prac-

Dr. Reyn. No more if it please your ma
teed.

jesty. His Maj. I have conferred with

my bislınps

Ilis Maj. If this be all your party hath to
about this point, and such order shall be taken say, I will make them conform themselves, or
there'n as is convenient. Nean time go on to else I will harrie them out of the land, or else
one other matter.

do worse.
Dr. Reyn. I desire, that according to cer Thus ended the second day's Conference,
tain provincial constitutions, the clergy may and the third began on the Wednesday follow-
have incetings every three weeks.-1. First in ins, Jan. 18, many knights, civilians, and doc-
Rural Deaneries, therein to have prophesying, tors of the law, being admitted thereunto, be-
as arch-bishop Grindall, and other bishops, de cause the High Commission was the principal
sired of her late majests.-2. That such things inatter in debate,
as could not be resolved on there, inight he His Maj. I understand, that the parties
referred to the arch-deacons visitations.-9. named in the High Commission are too many,
And so to the Episcopal Synod, to determine and too mean, ani the matters they deal with,
such points before not decided.

hase, such as ordinaries at home in their courts
His Maj. If you aim at a Scottish Preshy- might censure.
tery, it agreth as well with monarchy, as God dbp. of Cant. It is requisite their number
and the devil. Then Jack, and Tom, and will, should be inany, otherwise I should be forced
and Dick, shall meet and censure me and my ofien-times to sit alone, it in the absence of thie
council. Therefore I reiterate my former lørdis of the council, bishops, and judges at law,
speech, Le Roy s'uviseru; Stay, I pray, for some deans and doctors were not put into that
One seren years, before you demand, and then Commission, whose attendance I might com-
f you find me grow pursy and fat, I may, per mand with the more Authority : I have ofien
clance, hearken unto you, for that gove nment complained of the meanness of matters handled
will keep me in breath, and give me work therein, but cannot remedy it. For though the
enua:h. I shall speak of one matter more, offence he small, that the Ordinary may, the
someshat out of order, but it skilleth not; Dr. offender oft-cimes is so great, and contuma-
Reynolds, you have often spoken for my Supre- cious, that the Ordinary dare not punish him,
macy, and it is well : but know you any tiere, and so is forced to crave help at the High Com-
or elsewbere, who like of the present govern- mission.
ment ecclesiastical, and dislike my Supremacy? A numeless Lord. The proceedings in that
Dr. Reyn. I know none.

court, are hike the Spanish Inquisition, wherein
Why then I will tell you á tale: men are urged to subscribe more than law re-
after that the religion restored by king Edward quireth, and by the oath er officio, forced to
the sixth, was sooo overthrown by queen Mary | accuse themselves, being examined upon twenty,
bere in England, we in Scotland felt the effect or twenty four Articles on a sudden, without
of it. For thereupon Mr. Knox writes to the deliberation, and for the most part against
queen regent (a virtuous and moderate lady themselves.- In proof bereof, he produced a
telling her that she was the supreme head of Letter of an antient honourable counsellor, An.
the Church ; and charged her, as she would 1584, verifying this usage to two ministers in
answer it at God's tribunal, to take care of Cambridgeshire.
Christ his Evangil, in suppressing the Popish Abp. of Cant. Your lordship is deceived in
prelates, who withstood the same; but how the manner of proceeding; for, if the Article
long trow you did this continue ? Even till by touch the party for life, liberty, or scandal, he
her authoraty, the Popish bishops were repress- may refuse to answer; I can say nothing to
ed, and Knox, with bis adherents, being brought the particulars of the Letter, because twenty
in, made strong enough. Then began they to years since, yet doubted not, but at leisure, to
make small account of her supremacy, when, give your lordship satisfaction.
according to that inore light, wherewith they Lord Chan. There is necessity, and use of
were illuninated, they made a further refor the oath er officio, in divers courts, and causes.
mation of themselves. How they used the His Maj. Indeed civil proceedings only
poor lady my mother, is not unknown, and punish facts; but it is requisite that Fame and
how they dealt with me in my minority. I Scandals be looked unto in courts ecclesiastical,
tbus apply it. My lords, the bishops, I may and yet great moderation is to be used therein.
(This he said putting his hand to his hat) 1. In gravioribus criminibus. 2. In such
thank you that these men plend thus for my whereof there is a public faine, caused by
Supremacy. They think they cannot make the inordinate demeanour of the offender. -
their party good against you, but by appealing And here he soundly described the oath er
unto it; but if once you were out, and they in, officio, for the ground thereof, the wisdom of
I know what would become of my Suprernacy, the law therein, the manner of proceeding
for No Bishop, No King. I have learned of thereby, and profitable effect from the same.
what cut they bave been, who, preaching before Abp. of Cant. Undoubtedly your majesty
me, siuce my coming into England, passed speaks by the special assistance of God's spirit.

His Maj.

[ocr errors]
« PreviousContinue »